2020 U.S. Presidential elections

[Beebo Brink]

Right. That is parties evolving.

Doing a flip-flop on racism is change of sorts, but I'd hardly call it "evolving." This discussion/argument began with your view that Republicans who have left the party of Trump are somehow now better people than they were before, that their positions have evolved.

I disagree with that interpretation. Yes, those Republicans have left the party of Trump, but these people haven't changed, they have not morphed into more benevolent, liberal people holding new progressive ideals. They are the same bastards they've always been, they just don't have an organized party for their unevolved views that don't happen to be as vile as Trump, but are still pretty damn awful.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

Doing a flip-flop on racism is change of sorts, but I'd hardly call it "evolving." This discussion/argument began with your view that Republicans who have left the party of Trump are somehow now better people than they were before, that their positions have evolved.

I disagree with that interpretation. Yes, those Republicans have left the party of Trump, but these people haven't changed, they have not morphed into more benevolent, liberal people holding new progressive ideals. They are the same bastards they've always been, they just don't have an organized party for their unevolved views that don't happen to be as vile as Trump, but are still pretty damn awful.

US politics is already shifted so far to the right that conservatives in the USA might as well be Martians to conservatives in other European descended countries. And these Project Lincoln guys are trying to shove the Democratic Party even more to the right?

 

[Beebo Brink]

US politics is already shifted so far to the right that conservatives in the USA might as well be Martians to conservatives in other European descended countries. And these Project Lincoln guys are trying to shove the Democratic Party even more to the right?

So far they are a distinct group from the Democratic Party, and frankly I'd like to keep them that way. Just because they are opposed to Trump, it doesn't mean they should be welcomed with open arms into our party machinery or leadership. They have their own agenda, their own goals, which are based on "traditional" Republican values, pre-Trump. Respect for not falling under Trump's thrall and standing true to their ideals, but those ideals are not compatible with the Democratic party. They have been allies, but that doesn't make them friends.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

They have been allies,

That might be a bit generous; aside from some ad buys and paying a cartoonist I admire for some work, it looks like it was a giant grift. They were selling Biden/Harris quote gear and there's no clear path on where the money went.

 

[danielravennest]

I found a live stream of the various electoral college meetings in different states, if you want to see them cast their votes for president and vice-president. So far no armed thugs have interrupted the process:

 

[Dakota Tebaldi]

Yeah I'm not really big on lavishing the Lincoln Project with praise. I will acknowledge that they didn't drink the Trump flavor-aid and have done work to subvert him, and that's definitely good, but honestly isn't it the very least any Republican could have done in response to Trump?

 

[Pamela]

Doing a flip-flop on racism is change of sorts, but I'd hardly call it "evolving." This discussion/argument began with your view that Republicans who have left the party of Trump are somehow now better people than they were before, that their positions have evolved.

I disagree with that interpretation. Yes, those Republicans have left the party of Trump, but these people haven't changed, they have not morphed into more benevolent, liberal people holding new progressive ideals. They are the same bastards they've always been, they just don't have an organized party for their unevolved views that don't happen to be as vile as Trump, but are still pretty damn awful.

My point is what Plouffe and Schmidt said, which is not that we will all agree on issues and policies Going forward, but that we — all coalition members who defeated Trump — MUST going forward fight side by side to defeat the enemies of democracy.

When we fought alongside the Soviet Union to defeat the Nazis, it was for that purpose alone. It was not because we were in agreement with Stalin except on That one thing.

That said, I do think many of us have been profoundly changed by the last four years. BLM is just one example. Never have we seen a cross section of people pour out into the streets to demonstrate for weeks like that. Never.

 

[Pamela]

Yeah I'm not really big on lavishing the Lincoln Project with praise. I will acknowledge that they didn't drink the Trump flavor-aid and have done work to subvert him, and that's definitely good, but honestly isn't it the very least any Republican could have done in response to Trump?

What would you have them do, specifically what have you done that you know they did not?

 

[Dakota Tebaldi]

What would you have them do, specifically what have you done that you know they did not?

Spoken up at any point prior to election season, for starters.

Like during the Kavenaugh hearing.

Or during the completely secret "tax reform" fiasco.

Or during the midterms.

Or when the nation was embarrassed at Helsinki

Or during the fracking impeachment.

 

[Pamela]

Spoken up at any point prior to election season, for starters.

Like during the Kavenaugh hearing.

Or during the completely secret "tax reform" fiasco.

Or during the midterms.

Or when the nation was embarrassed at Helsinki

Or during the fracking impeachment.

I can’t have a discussion with someone who believes alternative facts.

 

[Dakota Tebaldi]

I can’t have a discussion with someone who believes alternative facts.

Are you saying they somehow did speak up at any of those times? Because the Lincoln Project didn't even exist until a year ago.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

I can’t have a discussion with someone who believes alternative facts.

You're better than this.

 

[Argent Stonecutter]

I can’t have a discussion with someone who believes alternative facts.

Are we playing "nonsequitur" now? Um. "Fish!"

 

[Lexxi]

I can’t have a discussion with someone who believes alternative facts.

What the fuck?

 

[Lady Darnk Juniorette]

*Drunken aunt laugh*

 

[Dakota Tebaldi]

*Drunken aunt laugh*

Where have YOU been, buster

 

[Free]

I can’t have a discussion with someone who believes alternative facts.

*tap tap tap*

I'm pretty sure we landed on the Moon.

 

[Lady Darnk Juniorette]

Where have YOU been, buster

My 10+ year super sekrit op of joining SLU/VVO to cause chaos that would destroy the chances of Biden winning has failed so there's no reason for me to post much.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

 

[Free]

Those clever Arizonianarites...

Fake electors try to deliver Arizona's 11 votes for Trump

In another sign of the lingering unrest over President Donald Trump's election loss, an Arizona group sent the National Archives in Washington, D.C., notarized documents last week intended to deliver, wrongly, the state's 11 electoral votes for him.

www.azcentral.com

In another sign of the lingering unrest over President Donald Trump's election loss, an Arizona group sent the National Archives in Washington, D.C., notarized documents last week intended to deliver, wrongly, the state's 11 electoral votes for him.

Copies of the documents obtained by The Arizona Republic show a group that claimed to represent the "sovereign citizens of the Great State of Arizona" submitted signed papers casting votes for what they want: a second term for Trump and Vice President Mike Pence.

Hopefully there's some law here that counts for jail time.