#BYEDON 2020 - The End Better Fucking Be Near

[Rose Karuna]

That's not the majority of Trump's base, although it's definitely part of it. Meth addicts alone couldn't have elected him president (especially given that many of them don't even vote, given their unstable history).

Yes, the ones who really blow my mind are people we know who are well educated and well off. They basically voted for tax cuts and say they don't care about the rest of it because "all politicians are the same". A lot of them changed their opinions after the way he has handled the COVID crisis though.

 

[Free]

 

[Innula Zenovka]

That always sounds good in theory, from a distance, especially from outside the U.S. But what you don't seem to grasp is that "their needs" that would "make their life better again" would be for black and brown people to shut up and take their abuse, women to bow to men's authority, especially over their bodies, and for gay people to die at birth. The overwhelming driver for Trump is White people's angst that they are not the dominant, controlling force in society anymore and that White Men have to compete for scarce resources against people they feel are inherently inferior to them, even if they don't quite despise them (which many do). They don't want the top 1% to be gutted because they still aspire to be one of those 1%; they don't want more money spread equally among all groups; they want more given to them and only them, because everyone else is undeserving in their eyes.

So no, I'm not going to support your approach for "how to really deal with it, once and for all".

Also, the guys I see on the news driving around in their SUVs, brandishing their long guns and wearing their "tactical" gear -- those toys aren't cheap.

 

[Kara Spengler]

Well, he needs a fuckbuddy in another country to shelter him when he flees the us.

 

[Soen Eber]

I suspect the "meth" vote is more corelation than cause. Can't prove it, but it would make sense that both meth and votes for Trump are symptoms of deeper issues, of people and places that have given up hope.

 

[Beebo Brink]

I suspect the "meth" vote is more corelation than cause. Can't prove it, but it would make sense that both meth and votes for Trump are symptoms of deeper issues, of people and places that have given up hope.

Keep in mind that "support for Trump" does not necessarily translate into "votes for Trump". Poverty, mental illness, prison time, homelessness, hopelessness -- these are conditions which make voting difficult. Showing up at a rally, screaming at libs, spouting Fox/Limbaugh/Trump tropes are all easy enough to do; keeping track of registration status and pulling together necessary documentation, then showing up at the polls to stand around possibly for hours, not so much.

The core Trump voters are people with stable lives.

 

[Soen Eber]

Keep in mind that "support for Trump" does not necessarily translate into "votes for Trump". Poverty, mental illness, prison time, homelessness, hopelessness -- these are conditions which make voting difficult. Showing up at a rally, screaming at libs, spouting Fox/Limbaugh/Trump tropes are all easy enough to do; keeping track of registration status and pulling together necessary documentation, then showing up at the polls to stand around possibly for hours, not so much.

The core Trump voters are people with stable lives.

Yes, but my suspicion is that living close to those communities which used to be stable, even if your own life situation is good, would engender a "blame the person" attitude. It always comes down to a "it's the nut behind the wheel / make cars safer" debate where some overfactor for individual responsibility. I could easily see Trump supporters being scared about what is happening around them, that their communities have changed for the worse and casting blame disproportionally instead of looking at the larger picture (or looking some place else such as conspiracy theories for the larger picture). And there are a lot of powerful people who want people to look "some place else".

Speaking entirely of something else, I read somewhere recently that five million jobs have been lost due to NAFTA and trade agreements with China, and that in communities where good jobs have been lost workers who used to have "good jobs" are now competing for the remaining jobs which immigrants have traditionally held in those communities. You know, the jobs that blacks, or Italians, or the Irish, or that women have held in previous generations.

Excuse me, I have to go now, I'm hearing a screeching, discordant rhyme from somewhere ... gotta track it down.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

People vote for political parties and candidates for all sorts of reasons, and I'd think that's particularly the case with Trump, since he has slogans that can mean whatever you want them to, rather than policies, with which you might agree or disagree.

So to my mind, the phrase "Trump supporters" is a simple descriptor -- people who, for whatever reason, express or demonstrate a degree of support for Donald Trump.

That might be because they like the tax cuts he's given them, or it might be because, since he expresses their prejudices, they think he understands them and their needs better than do the Democrats, or for any other sort of reason.

What they have in common, to my mind, is that, for whatever reason, they are prepared to tolerate both him and his administration.

 

[Dakota Tebaldi]

Improving rural America is an uphill battle like no other in this country, I think. People on TV talk about rural America like it has been forgotten and neglected, but that is not the case. There has been a massive continuous effort to improve rural life. The dump trucks full of federal cash being sunken into red states aren't just for EBT and Medicare. The problem is that large portions of these efforts are rejected by the people they are aimed at helping - either defeated at the ballot box, or simply not engaged with by the intended beneficiaries. And a big reason why that happens is because improving the quality of rural life involves change - changes in peoples' worldview and outlook.

Changes in their indoctrinated calculus about what kinds of help are okay to offer and who is rightly allowed to accept them, for instance. I mean, it's been demonstrated over and over (and over) again that poor white rural Americans will campaign or vote against assistance they really need, that would improve their lives immensely, if their political or religious leaders tell them that some of that assistance would end up going to people who in their worldview don't deserve it or shouldn't be getting it. They will vote against welfare programs in order to spite mythical "welfare queens", and then complain that help isn't available for "people who really need it", even though help would be available for those people if they had only voted for it. They will vote against health care measures because right now, even four years later with most of it dismantled, all health care is "Obamacare" in their heads, and Obamacare is inherently evil, period.

And that's just the political side. Another side is cultural romanticism. Proud rural Americans have a fixed idea of what rural America is supposed to look like - the aesthetic itself is a vital part of their assumed identity. For no other reason than this many of them resist improvement, because it's just a fact that a major part of improving rural America involves modernizing the infrastructure and services, and that is simply unacceptable to the point of sacrilege for so many. Modern building standards, wheelchair accessibility ramps, and safety inspections are the liberal city encroaching on the country. Cell towers and other communications infrastructure give you cancer. Solar panels suck up all the sunlight, killing all the plants in the area. Wind turbines...give you cancer. And on it goes. Rural Americans are not neglected. The help is available; the doctor is in. They're just refusing treatment because they believe they can pray the illness away.

 

[Aribeth Zelin]

Improving rural America is an uphill battle like no other in this country, I think. People on TV talk about rural America like it has been forgotten and neglected, but that is not the case. There has been a massive continuous effort to improve rural life. The dump trucks full of federal cash being sunken into red states aren't just for EBT and Medicare. The problem is that large portions of these efforts are rejected by the people they are aimed at helping - either defeated at the ballot box, or simply not engaged with by the intended beneficiaries. And a big reason why that happens is because improving the quality of rural life involves change - changes in peoples' worldview and outlook.

Changes in their indoctrinated calculus about what kinds of help are okay to offer and who is rightly allowed to accept them, for instance. I mean, it's been demonstrated over and over (and over) again that poor white rural Americans will campaign or vote against assistance they really need, that would improve their lives immensely, if their political or religious leaders tell them that some of that assistance would end up going to people who in their worldview don't deserve it or shouldn't be getting it. They will vote against welfare programs in order to spite mythical "welfare queens", and then complain that help isn't available for "people who really need it", even though help would be available for those people if they had only voted for it. They will vote against health care measures because right now, even four years later with most of it dismantled, all health care is "Obamacare" in their heads, and Obamacare is inherently evil, period.

And that's just the political side. Another side is cultural romanticism. Proud rural Americans have a fixed idea of what rural America is supposed to look like - the aesthetic itself is a vital part of their assumed identity. For no other reason than this many of them resist improvement, because it's just a fact that a major part of improving rural America involves modernizing the infrastructure and services, and that is simply unacceptable to the point of sacrilege for so many. Modern building standards, wheelchair accessibility ramps, and safety inspections are the liberal city encroaching on the country. Cell towers and other communications infrastructure give you cancer. Solar panels suck up all the sunlight, killing all the plants in the area. Wind turbines...give you cancer. And on it goes. Rural Americans are not neglected. The help is available; the doctor is in. They're just refusing treatment because they believe they can pray the illness away.

Reminds me of an old friend of mine, who has been in danger of losing his house off and on for years. He would rant on and on about how those people were lazy and ought to be working, without considering they were -all- in the same boat as him.

 

[Jolene Benoir]

Hasn't there always been poverty, poor education and other problems in some rural communities? I'm thinking back to say, Appalachia, for much of the 19th/20th century. That is just an example, but there have been pocket of it throughout the country for pretty much our entire existence as a nation. Much of it is concentrated in the south, but not all, by any means. I wonder if that doesn't have to do with it having been historically more agrarian. Those and similar jobs such as coal are going away and won't be back. There are still a good many people who haven't adapted, have a romanticized view of work, that they must do back breaking labor or it's sissified, or didn't adapt as we moved away from that type of labor, had jobs shipped overseas or in the case of farms, became completely overrun with multinational corporations calling the shots. There is still work in that arena, but perhaps they feel they are too good for it and leave it to immigrants where said corporation completely take advantage of them.

There is crushing poverty, drug issues in every city as well as lack of access to a proper education. The education is there but is wildly different if you live in the inner city or a suburb. I'm not seeing Trumpers or those who seek to understand them clamoring for these folks to be heard, for everyone to sit down and listen to the needs of a single mother living in what are effectively ghettoes.

One thing I do think that needs to be addressed in rural areas is lack of access to hospitals, and mental health care (not that some of these folks would avail themselves of it) which is becoming a larger and larger problem. This country, I think, is in great need of an FDR type approach to so many of our needs. If we were to work on some of our infrastructure that alone could employ many people as well as improve lives. There is one party that diametrically opposes that and we know which one it is. God, guns and liberty is the rallying cry. Well, many are listening to two bit shysters in the religious arena, caring more for their guns than children and manipulated by an organization that only seeks to sell more guns as well as take Russian money. As to liberty, some again have not adapted to the times, considering themselves some sort of wild west hero in their own minds and think they are the only ones deserving of it.

 

[Veritable Quandry]

A lot of aid to rural areas has been grossly ineffective, in part because the conservative representatives from these areas are resisting the very programs that would provide meaningful help and economic opportunity. Boosting education, providing unemployment and welfare, food aid, infrastructure spending, and rural healthcare are the exact parts of the budget that their representatives are against. Biden wants to boost both rural clinics and trade schools, while increasing infrastructure spending that feeds construction jobs. Look for the people whose voters would benefit the most to block those programs out of fear of "socialism" and partisan spite.

 

[Sid]

Well, he needs a fuckbuddy in another country to shelter him when he flees the us.

N. Korea?
I don't think so. If he flees, it will be to one of the Arabian Oil Countries. Much more luxury and possibilities to scam with Trump Towers, golf courses and luxury homes.
There is no business model for him in N. Korea.
In N.K. he could only write his memoirs, which as we all know, he needs a ghost writer for. Where to get those there?

 

[danielravennest]

Improving rural America is an uphill battle like no other in this country, I think.

Having lived in rural Alabama, while working in a tech town (Huntsville), I think a lot of the problem is structural for the same reason minority areas in a city get shortchanged. A bunch of low income people provides a small tax base, so city and county things like schools have no money. Poor education then leads to more low income people. The same logic applies to other civic improvements. In contrast, the City of Atlanta is spending $4.8 billion to build the "Beltline", 25 miles of walking, biking, and light rail paths circling the city. In turn that is bringing in massive investments along the corridor. They can do this because they have the money and borrowing power.

 

[Free]

Behind the scenes, Trump frustrated with his legal team's maneuvers

While the president publicly praises his legal team, he has privately expressed frustration with the slapdash nature of his election defense fight.

www.nbcnews.com

While President Donald Trump has publicly praised his legal team’s efforts, he has privately expressed frustration with the slapdash nature of his election defense fight, according to several people familiar with the discussions.

The president has been complaining to aides and allies about his personal attorney Rudy Giuliani and recently-removed lawyer Sidney Powell’s over-the-top performances at a news conference at the Republican National Committee headquarters last week, these people said. Both Giuliani and Powell have continued to make conspiratorial and baseless claims about widespread voter fraud, for which they have provided no evidence.

The president is concerned his team is comprised of “fools that are making him look bad,” said one source familiar with the thinking. Asked why he would not fire them, this person replied, in essence, who knows?

Because bottom of the barrel doesn't offer any other options!

 

[Dakota Tebaldi]

Behind the scenes, Trump frustrated with his legal team's maneuvers

While the president publicly praises his legal team, he has privately expressed frustration with the slapdash nature of his election defense fight.

www.nbcnews.com

100% believable, IMO. Trump likes being a showman himself but he certainly expects the people who actually do the work of running his businesses and his legal team to have a no-nonsense all-business public face. His lawyers are supposed to be grave and ominous in their press conferences; they're supposed to be scary and professional and competent and making it clear that his challenge is serious, and that serious people agree with it. Instead they're a clown show, waving their hands around, making funny voices to mock reporters, and talking about freaking releasing krakens. It's embarrassing and he should be embarrassed.

 

[Eunoli]

Various worries about Michigan...

NEVER have I been more relieved to be wrong about something.

 

[Sid]

100% believable, IMO. Trump likes being a showman himself but he certainly expects the people who actually do the work of running his businesses and his legal team to have a no-nonsense all-business public face. His lawyers are supposed to be grave and ominous in their press conferences; they're supposed to be scary and professional and competent and making it clear that his challenge is serious, and that serious people agree with it. Instead they're a clown show, waving their hands around, making funny voices to mock reporters, and talking about freaking releasing krakens. It's embarrassing and he should be embarrassed.

Wasn't his whole presidency embarrassing?
Ringling Brothers and Barnum & Bailey Circus would have been very proud of such a clowns act in their better days.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

Instead they're a clown show, waving their hands around, making funny voices to mock reporters, and talking about freaking releasing krakens. It's embarrassing and he should be embarrassed.

But, but

Spoiler: imitation is the sincerest form of flattery!