Confederate flag/statue banning thread

Romana

The Timeless Child
Joined
Sep 21, 2018
Messages
1,976
SL Rez
2010
Looking at statues isn't, of course, the only way to learn about history.

Reading books is recommended too, or always used to be, and, since we don't actually have many statues of US Civil War generals from either side for me to look at in the UK, that's what I've been doing recently.

Over the last few weeks, I've been reading:

The Half Has Never Been Told: Slavery and the Making of American Capitalism by Edward E Baptist
Stamped from the Beginning: The Definitive History of Racist Ideas in America by Ibram X Kendi
The End of the Myth: From the Frontier to the Border Wall in the Mind of America by Greg Grandin
White Trash: The 400-Year Untold History of Class in America by Nancy Isenberg

If Bubba (or anyone else, of course) would like to discuss any of them, I would welcome the opportunity.

It's really opened my eyes --I've never before realised what an essential role slavery played, right from the the late C15th onwards, in the original colonisation of America, the development of the US economy and society, the course of US and world history, and the world economy in general, with most of it done on credit issued by European banks like Barings and Rothschilds.
I do hope Bubba takes up the challenge. That would be fun to see, and, hey! educational, too.
Oh, in case he pulls that "all slaveholders were Democrats" line, here's the debunk.
For the record.

 
  • 1Like
Reactions: Innula Zenovka

Innula Zenovka

Nasty Brit
VVO Supporter 🍦🎈👾❤
Joined
Sep 20, 2018
Messages
6,074
SLU Posts
18459
I do hope Bubba takes up the challenge. That would be fun to see, and, hey! educational, too.
Oh, in case he pulls that "all slaveholders were Democrats" line, here's the debunk.
For the record.

I think the link needs fixing (I've got an Instant Pot -- it's great).
 

Casey Pelous

Senior Discount
VVO Supporter 🍦🎈👾❤
Joined
Sep 24, 2018
Messages
566
Location
USA, upper left corner
SL Rez
2007
Joined SLU
February, 2011
SLU Posts
10461
I do hope Bubba takes up the challenge. That would be fun to see, and, hey! educational, too.
Oh, in case he pulls that "all slaveholders were Democrats" line, here's the debunk.
For the record.

Romana, I'm not sure even the awesome power of Chocolate Chip Skillet Cookies could make a difference in that thick skull. :p
 

Katheryne Helendale

🐱 Kitty Queen🐱
Joined
Sep 20, 2018
Messages
4,277
Location
Right... Behind... You...
SL Rez
2008
Joined SLU
October 2009
SLU Posts
65535
I do hope Bubba takes up the challenge. That would be fun to see, and, hey! educational, too.
Oh, in case he pulls that "all slaveholders were Democrats" line, here's the debunk.
For the record.

I'm having a sudden craving for chocolate chip cookies for some reason. :p
 
  • 1Agree
Reactions: Grandma Bates

Khamon

Folk Harpist
Joined
Sep 23, 2018
Messages
773
Location
Alabama
SL Rez
2003
Joined SLU
2007
yeah the whole rest of the day is now devoted to dark chocolate chip skillet cookies thanks a lot
 
  • 1LOL
Reactions: Jolene Benoir

Romana

The Timeless Child
Joined
Sep 21, 2018
Messages
1,976
SL Rez
2010
I do hope Bubba takes up the challenge. That would be fun to see, and, hey! educational, too.
Oh, in case he pulls that "all slaveholders were Democrats" line, here's the debunk.
For the record.

Oops.
Wrong link, lol. . Here's the one I meant to put.
 

Cristiano

Full Frontal Nerdity
Admin
Joined
Sep 19, 2018
Messages
3,124
SL Rez
2002
Joined SLU
Nov 2003
SLU Posts
35836

Sid

Lurking until the next post
VVO Supporter 🍦🎈👾❤
Joined
Sep 20, 2018
Messages
3,169
Location
Limburg, NL
SL Rez
2007
Joined SLU
Yes

Innula Zenovka

Nasty Brit
VVO Supporter 🍦🎈👾❤
Joined
Sep 20, 2018
Messages
6,074
SLU Posts
18459
Sort of. Here in the South the monuments and statues are part of a more complex context. They are one part of the constant message designed to insure that certain people know their place. As an example, two years ago during construction of a building the graves of a group of slaves were uncovered, and they were quickly and quietly moved to a nearby cemetery. When word got out there was a good deal of outrage from the African American community that the proper notification and care was not extended to the remains, but there was total silence outside of that. At the same time we have a rather large memorial on the main thoroughfare to the local soldiers who were killed in the "War For Southern Independence." Every time there has been talk of moving it to a nearby battlefield you can hear the uproar two counties away. The message to the community is clear.

At the same time, there is some truth to the notion of preserving history. If you look around at the names on buildings, especially on university campuses, those names belong to staunch segregationists. Their own graves have likely been only recently filled, but their immediate families are still around running things. In a context where the names of recent oppressors are still immediately present the monuments from 100 years ago help fill in the details to insure a constant message of the long tradition of state sponsored oppression. The monuments and statues do preserve history, and it is the history of violence and hatred against the descendants of African slaves.

It is more than a little frustrating that the larger context and history is ignored by the national media. The current status of oppression is not a priority, and there is no effort to try and explore the wider ignorance of the local dynamic.
This provides an example, I think:

The monument was completed in 1907 and sits on a site that once housed the hub of Hampton Roads’ slave trade.
I mention this particular example because I happened to have read about it only the other day:
Years after slavery ended, former slave Charles Grandy reflected on the motives of the enslavers who had shipped him from Virginia to New Orleans for sale. After a lifetime, he had made it back to Norfolk. Now he asked his interviewer, an African-American academic just like Claude Anderson of Hampton University, if the young man understood the significance of the statue of the Confederate soldier that loomed on a high pillar down by the harbor. Grandy himself had once passed the statue’s eventual site in the hold of a slave ship. “Know what it mean?” Grandy asked. But the question mark was rhetorical, he already had an answer ready: it meant, he told the interviewer, “Carry the nigger down south if you want to rule him.”
Edward E. Baptist: The Half Has Never Been Told: Slavery and the Making of American Capitalism
 

Free

10K under the hat
VVO Supporter 🍦🎈👾❤
Joined
Sep 22, 2018
Messages
10,025
Location
Underground in America
SL Rez
2008
Joined SLU
2009
SLU Posts
55565
 

Free

10K under the hat
VVO Supporter 🍦🎈👾❤
Joined
Sep 22, 2018
Messages
10,025
Location
Underground in America
SL Rez
2008
Joined SLU
2009
SLU Posts
55565

Romana

The Timeless Child
Joined
Sep 21, 2018
Messages
1,976
SL Rez
2010
He's another asshole who needs to diaff..... just saying. Not because he's a republican, but because he's an assholeto the nth.
Oh, definitely. That's was just they imager that popped into my head from his paranoid projections, lol.