Trump's border wall looks more like a fence

[Cindy Claveau]

Anyway, the Maignot Line was also a series of fortifications, not a wall, and it was supposed to stop an actual invasion, not to hinder migration.

I figured someone would harsh on my attempt at cleverness No hot fudge for you!

 

[Facts Not Feelings]

Can they name even one country that has secured its borders with a wall that successfully kept out immigrants and invaders?

Yes, the Israeli West Bank Barrier.
(if you want to start an OpenBoardersForIsrael campaign, i am all for it)

Even the Great Wall of China was breached fairly often.

The only one who was able to breach the Great Wall of China was Genghis Khan, first in the year 1211, this is 1800 years after it got built (700BC).

 

[Free]

Now he's teaching us wall history.

 

[Clara D.]

Mr Nielsen said: "Let me be clear: Walls work."

I'm wondering how hilarious the cartels with tunnel boring equipment found this.

 

[Facts Not Feelings]

I'm wondering how hilarious the cartels with tunnel boring equipment found this.

Just because there is no solution to solve it to 100% doesn't mean that a solution that solves it to 90% is a bad thing.

Also making a tunnel takes ages and it's easy to detect, and then they can start all over again and make the next one — here we also have the example of Israel:
tunnel detection technology

 

[Free]

 

[Facts Not Feelings]

> everything that doesn't solve the problem to 100% is a bad idea

Ok, then i guess we should stop convicting murderers, because we aren't able to catch 100% of those, so it's obviously not working and we shouldn't do anything at all if we can't get all.

 

[Free]

Ok, then i guess we should stop convicting murderers, because we aren't able to catch 100% of those, so it's obviously not working and we shouldn't do anything at all if we can't get all.

It's not whether it works 100% or not at something, it's that the marketing team aka Trump says it will do even better than that, because his wall is MAGIC.

 

[Clara D.]

@WankstoFacts

Dunno why you're posting in this thread, the wall isn't being built to keep trans people out.

 

[Facts Not Feelings]

It's not whether it works 100% or not at something, it's that the marketing team aka Trump says it will do even better than that, because his wall is MAGIC.

So your whole problem is about how it's being marketed?
You are surprised that politicians tend to exaggerate the effectiveness of their proposals.

btw. it is the only effective way. Go ahead and propose another way that's as effective.

 

[Free]

btw. it is the only effective way. Go ahead and propose another way that's as effective.

I don't bother proposing solutions to non-problems.

 

[Facts Not Feelings]

I don't bother proposing solutions to non-problems.

>Child trafficking is not a problem
Ok
>drug cartels are not a problem
Ok, i could post some graphic examples and videos about the nice practices of drug cartels in Mexico. They have some torture methods that are more extreme than ISIS, like flaying.

 

[Jolene Benoir]

Logged in solely to report the above post. Just posting it so that Cris isn't inundated.

I think this is my first ever post report, but this creature is loathesome.

 

[Essence Lumin]

Facts not Feelings now on ignore. Not something I do often.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

dis·in·gen·u·ous
/ˌdisənˈjenyo͞oəs/
adjective

1. not candid or sincere, typically by pretending that one knows less about something than one really does.

 

[Spirits Rising]

Oh for fuck sake...

 

[Innula Zenovka]

It's not whether it works 100% or not at something, it's that the marketing team aka Trump says it will do even better than that, because his wall is MAGIC.

You're right -- it's magical thinking rather than anything else.

I mean, in serious policy-making you'd start by analysing the problem(s) and then by devising possible remedies and trying to do some cost-benefit analyses. For example, it's by no means clear to me that a physical barrier (be it a wall or slats) is, on its own, going to be a particularly good method of stopping illegal drugs from entering the USA, since you're still going to need surveillance along the border to prevent drugs being transported over the wall) and presumably the more the barrier impedes smugglers, the more it encourages them to use either existing alternative routes or to discover new ones).

So a sensible analysis would look not simply at smuggling (contraband or people) across the Mexican land border but at the whole question of smugglers' routes into the USA. A physical barrier along the Mexican border might be part of a solution, along with several other measures, or it might that the money spent on building and maintaining a physical barrier and the necessary surveillance to stop people simply getting ladders and ropes across it might be better spent on surveillance alone.

After all, the point about walls historically -- the Great Wall of China or Hadrian's Wall -- wasn't simply that they were physical barriers but that they provided a permanent line of garrisons and raised observation points from which invading armies and migrant tribes (as opposed to small groups of smugglers or migrants) could be detected while a long way off, and a road along which troops could move to defend and reinforce points at which they might cross.

They were part of whole strategy, which may or may not be a good one for the present day, now that both sides have rather more sophisticated communications and surveillance systems and methods of transport.

All this, though, is real world thinking about how to fix real world problems. Trump's wall is something else -- a totemic structure to symbolise protection from malign external forces, and maybe also a physical monument to Trump and his desire to be remembered (the same impulse that has made him want to put his name on large buildings all over the world).

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

Navy intel vet talking about how useless a wall is.

Reup Jim Wright's thread on wall logistics.

 

[Tigger]

Yes, the Israeli West Bank Barrier.
(if you want to start an OpenBoardersForIsrael campaign, i am all for it)

The only one who was able to breach the Great Wall of China was Genghis Khan, first in the year 1211, this is 1800 years after it got built (700BC).

1) You missed the berlin wall too. Of course you need to patrol the wall, slap mines and lots of razor wire on it, alarm systems, beds of metal spikes, machine gun posts, guard dog runs, tank barriers, anti vehicle ditches. A plain unmanned wall is useless.

2) An invading army is not the same as individual travellers crossing a border. A cursory glance at the history of the great wall will show you that your statement is incorrect. Further, although the wall may have begun construction around 700bc construction didn't end until 1644, Over 2000 years later. You want to wait 2000 years for Trumps folly to be finished?

3) majority of illegal migrants into the US enter on valid visas, such as tourist visas, and overstay. Total impact of a wall on people overstaying their visas....None.

Your facts are very selective.

 

[Romana]

Facts not Feelings now on ignore. Not something I do often.

Me too. Fastest I ever put anyone on ignore, I think. Not that I've put that many on ignore here or on the previous forum.