The US-Iran War Has Begun

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When the world starts to clash one is nowhere perfectly safe. Not even in the USA. Not even if you belong to the top 10 of the richest people in the world.
The difference between UAE and the US is almost everyone who lives there is from elsewhere. It's hard to see how a rich city can come back after emptying out if that is what it comes to.
 

Bartholomew Gallacher

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I'm sorry, but I have a real problem with this kind of populist approach. The problem isn't that the right-wing extremist Netanyahu government is determining US policy, and Donald Trump would, however he behaved in other contexts, if it wasn't for Netanyahu, behave perfectly reasonably and rationally in the Middle East.

It's that US policy, foreign, military and domestic, is being determined by the whims of a man who was elected by a narrow majority of the popular vote in 2024 by an electorate who were prepared to ignore his glaring character flaws, his multiple felony convictions and his previous attempt at insurrection, and that the US Congress and Senate are not currently prepared to use their constitutional powers to restrain him.
What you are not taking into account is that Trump is not a normal president, but a wannabe dictator. Your rebuttal mostly views America still as a sovereign actor making bad choices, but at the moment that's the past.

Today America is a compromised actor, which is actively exploited by Netanyahu (and also probably in other areas by Vladimir Putin) to allow/do things former presidents never were willing to do so, because at least they were doing in one point their job how intended, namely considering American national interests and security concerns first. And prioritising them.

So of course you can - rightfully - blame the internal developments in America for it. But that's too narrow minded, because Netanyahu is actively exploiting this chance he got with Trump in office now, he never had in decades. For Netanyahu Trump is a god send enabler to finally wreck havoc upon the whole Middle East, like he's doing now. All presidents before were always restraining Israel when it went too far, but Trump is the opposite to that.

You cannot blame Israel for the bad choices Americans made and bad state of the country - but exploiting it actively and taking it to their own advantage then is a different cup of tea. Of course you might say that you cannot blame people for taking chances when to do arrive, true.

But it also on depends on how far people willing to use that chances. If they are overstretching trust and partnership, like Netyanhu does, you can and must criticise it.
 
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Innula Zenovka

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There is a lot of blame to go around, certainly. We are watching in horror in the US as our democratic institutions and guardrails have mostly fallen, and nothing is being done to rein Trump's worst impulses in. That said, Netanyahu has wanted to attack Iran for decades. He finally found a US administration dumb enough to do it with sheer flattery of our brain dead leader. Trump did not win the 2024 election, he was installed again with the help of Elon. Unfortunately for us all, we are being dragged along for the ride. We would, however, not be attacking Iran right now even with Trump had it not been for Netanyahu. It served zero interests for the US, but everything for Netantyahu and his corrupt government.
The US probably wouldn't be attacking Iran right now if it wasn't for the Epstein files, either, or if the prospects for the Republicans in the November elections didn't look so dire.

As you say, "That said, Netanyahu has wanted to attack Iran for decades. He finally found a US administration dumb enough to do it with sheer flattery of our brain dead leader." Was Trump so much less susceptible to flattery, or more intelligent, from 2016--2020, or all last year?

And is Netanyahu also responsible for the Republicans in Congress or the Senate refusing to do their jobs and act as some sort of check on an out-of-control president?
 
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The difference between UAE and the US is almost everyone who lives there is from elsewhere. It's hard to see how a rich city can come back after emptying out if that is what it comes to.
Rich people love the luxury living there. They will come back IMHO. They want to be among likewise people. As a loaded person one cant be seen on a camping sight or it has to be one exclusively for a 2 million dollar and upwards mobile home.
 

Bartholomew Gallacher

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And is Netanyahu also responsible for the Republicans in Congress or the Senate refusing to do their jobs and act as some sort of check on an out-of-control president?
No, he is not. But: in the past America was the watchdog always holding Israel back when they were starting too harsh things, like throwing fuel canisters into an already burning house. Now with Trump in the office America switched position from watchdog to cheerleader, letting Netanyahu off the leash.

It is still though Netanyahu's own decision that throwing the fuel into the burning house is a good thing, and also action. And for that action his administration can be held accountable, no matter how the president in the Whiite House came into power or the internal state of affairs in America.
 

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You cannot blame Israel for the bad choices Americans made and bad state of the country - but exploiting it actively and taking it to their own advantage then is a different cup of tea. Of course you might say that you cannot blame people for taking chances when to do arrive, true.

But it also on depends on how far people willing to use that chances. If they are overstretching trust and partnership, like Netyanhu does, you can and must criticise it.
Bernie Sanders, whose tweet you quoted, is a US politician addressing a US audience. To my mind, he should be attacking Trump for involving the US in an illegal and ill-thought-out war for no good reason, and the US Congress for failing to exercise their constitutional duty to restrain him. Blaming a foreign government for Trump's bad decisions and the Republicans' cowardice is missing the point. It's like the way people used to blame the king's evil councillors for whatever went wrong, not the king for listening to them.

No, he is not. But: in the past America was the watchdog always holding Israel back when they were starting too harsh things, like throwing fuel canisters into an already burning house. Now with Trump in the office America switched position from watchdog to cheerleader, letting Netanyahu off the leash.

It is still though Netanyahu's own decision that throwing the fuel into the burning house is a good thing, and also action. And for that action his administration can be held accountable, no matter how the president in the Whiite House came into power.
I agree, but Bernie Sanders is a US politician addressing a US audience. He should be holding the US administration accountable. If Keir Starmer had gone along with Trump's demands that we support this war, people here in the UK would be blaming Starmer, and rightly so, for dragging us into it, rather than Trump, just as we blame Blair rather than Bush for dragging us into Iraq.
 
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Trumps threats against Greenland and Canada have opened the door for attacking Venezuela (sp?) and Iran. There's a word for that but I forget now ..

Price anchor.

Although now it's fear anchoring. "*phew*, at least he's not attacking Canada."
 
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The US probably wouldn't be attacking Iran right now if it wasn't for the Epstein files, either, or if the prospects for the Republicans in the November elections didn't look so dire.

As you say, "That said, Netanyahu has wanted to attack Iran for decades. He finally found a US administration dumb enough to do it with sheer flattery of our brain dead leader." Was Trump so much less susceptible to flattery, or more intelligent, from 2016--2020, or all last year?

And is Netanyahu also responsible for the Republicans in Congress or the Senate refusing to do their jobs and act as some sort of check on an out-of-control president?
We did attack Iran last year at Netanyahu's behest with targetted strikes on their nuclear production. In 2017-2020, there were still adults in charge of the military and around Trump. This time is a very very different situation. Netanyahu through AIPAC has also captured Congress. I don't get it, but they all seem to be fucking beholden to Israel. It makes zero sense, and America suffers at the whims of Israel.
 

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Bernie Sanders, whose tweet you quoted, is a US politician addressing a US audience. To my mind, he should be attacking Trump for involving the US in an illegal and ill-thought-out war for no good reason, and the US Congress for failing to exercise their constitutional duty to restrain him. Blaming a foreign government for Trump's bad decisions and the Republicans' cowardice is missing the point. It's like the way people used to blame the king's evil councillors for whatever went wrong, not the king for listening to them.



I agree, but Bernie Sanders is a US politician addressing a US audience. He should be holding the US administration accountable. If Keir Starmer had gone along with Trump's demands that we support this war, people here in the UK would be blaming Starmer, and rightly so, for dragging us into it, rather than Trump, just as we blame Blair rather than Bush for dragging us into Iraq.
Are you under the illusion we are also not blaming Trump and only Netanyahu? We can do both. I blame Trump, I blame Hegseth, I blame Stephen Miller and I blame Netanyahu. It is an axis of evil, incompetence and stupidity that have led us into war and the brink of WW3.
 

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The ongoing conflict in the Middle East has seen a surge of misinformation, as unverified claims and clips do the rounds on social media. The latest to go viral concerns Itamar Ben-Gvir, Israel's National Security Minister, and Iddo Netanyahu, the brother of Israel PM Benjamin Netanyahu.

Many social media accounts are claiming that an Iranian air strike in Tel Aviv, the capital of Israel, has led to the death of Iddo Netanyahu and injured Itamar Ben Gvir after the latter's house purportedly caught fire.
However, the claims are false. There are no reports or official confirmation that Itamar Ben Gvir's residence in Tel Aviv was targeted in an air strike. There are also no reports of an attack on Iddo Netanyahu. The claims that they were hit are hoax, Ht.com can confirm.
 

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‘The Air is Unbreathable’: Tehran Shrouded in Cloud of Toxic Smoke After Israel Strikes Fuel Depots
Iran’s capital was engulfed in a cloud of toxic smoke that unleashed black rainfall dozens of miles away on Sunday after overnight Israeli strikes on several fuel depots caused fires to burn for hours.

Images from Tehran, a city of nearly 10 million people, showed thick black smoke from the fires hanging over it, while residents reported difficulty breathing and oil-tainted rainfall staining everything around them.
"The rain is black, I can't believe it, I'm seeing black rain," Kianoosh, 44, a Tehran resident and engineer, told TIME. "It's even in Tajrish, which is miles and miles away from the oil tanks."
 

Bartholomew Gallacher

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Bernie Sanders, whose tweet you quoted, is a US politician addressing a US audience. To my mind, he should be attacking Trump for involving the US in an illegal and ill-thought-out war for no good reason, and the US Congress for failing to exercise their constitutional duty to restrain him. Blaming a foreign government for Trump's bad decisions and the Republicans' cowardice is missing the point. It's like the way people used to blame the king's evil councillors for whatever went wrong, not the king for listening to them.
Bernie Sanders being who he is is constantly attacking Trump on a wide array of topics. Just because I only hand picked now one tweet with a different recipient this doesn't mean there were no others attacking Trump directly, far from it. And that's the flaw in your train of thought.

E.g. like this:
 
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Bartholomew Gallacher

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US intelligence agencies have intercepted encrypted communications from Iran that may serve as an operational trigger for sleeper cells in America.

The exact contents cannot be determined, it though warrants heightened situational awareness. There is no operational threat tied to a specific location.

So in other words: we might see soon a wave of terror attack attempts and some succesful attacks initiated by Iran all over America.

 
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Bartholomew Gallacher

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CNN had an interview with Kamal Kharazi, foreign policy advisor to Iran's supreme leader. He is telling the obvious, that Iran is determined more than ever to resist and go all-in. Also that diplomacy is dead for now. So this means to reach his goals - whatever they might be - Trump will have to escalate, otherwise reaching them is impossible.

Kharazi is stating that the war "is an existential threat to the Islamic Republic. Therefore, we have to stay with full might as we are doing now."

"I don't see any room for diplomacy anymore – Trump has deceived others and not keeping his promises. We experienced this twice during negotiations – while we were engaged in talks, they struck us," he said.

"There's no room unless the economic pressure is built up to the extent that other countries would intervene to guarantee the termination of aggression by Americans and Israelis against Iran," Kharazi said, suggesting that Gulf Arab countries and others need to put pressure on the U.S. to end the war.

"This war has been producing a lot of pressure – economic pressure – on others, in terms of inflation and lack of energy, and so if it continues, this pressure will build up further, and therefore others will have no choice but to intervene," he added.

Asked whether the Iranian military and the supreme leadership is now united moving forward, Kharazi said: "Yes, exactly."

"The responsibility of the leader of the Islamic Republic of Iran is to lead the country's defense capability, and therefore, as Ayatollah Khamenei was doing that, the new leader will continue," he said.

Trump said last week that Khamenei's appointment as his father's successor would be "unacceptable" to him. "That is not his business," Kharazi said.

Israel says its war aim is to overthrow Iran's system of clerical rule. U.S. officials mainly say Washington aims to destroy Iran's missile capabilities and nuclear program, but Trump has said the war can end only with a compliant Iranian government.

Israel had said it would kill whoever succeeded the elder Khamenei. Fox News quoted Trump as saying that he was "not happy" with the choice.

 
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Bartholomew Gallacher

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There are right now often rumors going around that China has deployed its super space tracking ship Liaowang-1 to the Persian Gulf to observe the American forces and collect data.

This is false information, the Liaowang-1 has been in the port of Shanghai all of the time.

 
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Innula Zenovka

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We did attack Iran last year at Netanyahu's behest with targetted strikes on their nuclear production. In 2017-2020, there were still adults in charge of the military and around Trump. This time is a very very different situation. Netanyahu through AIPAC has also captured Congress. I don't get it, but they all seem to be fucking beholden to Israel. It makes zero sense, and America suffers at the whims of Israel.
I think AIPAC's influence is diminishing, in that they certainly seem to have lost many of the Democrats, and I would suspect that the Republicans are considerably more scared of Trump than they are of either AIPAC or Netanyahu. Furthermore, Trump is perfectly capable of putting Netanyahu in his box when he needs to. Remember last year when Trump made him apologise to Qatar for bombing Dohar and killing a Hamas leader?

More generally, I don't think this is a question of America suffering at the whims of Israel at all. The US has long considered both the Middle East and the Persian Gulf as areas of major geostrategic interest (which of course they are) and has, consequently, long meddled in the affairs of countries in the area, at various times promoting loyal allies and proxies, including, at various times, Iran, Iraq, Israel and Saudi, in order to promote what the US sees as its interests.

Similarly, the regional players attempt to promote their own interests by using their relationship with the US -- Qatar didn't give Trump his very own flying palace out of the goodness of their hearts, after all. They wanted something out of him. I don't blame anyone, including Netanyahu, for doing that.

Meanwhile, Iran and Israel are, and have been since the 1979 Iranian revolution overthrew the Shah, until then a close ally of the US and Israel, deadly enemies. Whatever we may think of Netanyahu or the State of Israel in general, Israel has every reason to want to see an end to the current Iranian regime, who are every bit as bad as the current government of Israel, and the proxies it sponsors like Hamas and Hezbollah and the Houthis, and every reason to encourage the US to support, both politically and militarily, its efforts against Iran.

I don't blame Israel for trying to manipulate the US to its own advantage, any more than I blame any other government in the area for for doing the same.

The US does what it does in the Middle East and elsewhere because of what it sees as its own interests, and always has done. It often takes deeply misguided decisions that serve only to make a bad situation worse, whether in the Middle East, the Americas or elsewhere, and Trump is clearly more predisposed to take, and easily manipulated into taking, bad decisions than most other presidents. But there's absolutely no reason to believe that Trump, or any other president, would take better decisions, or be a better man, if it wasn't for foreigners manipulating him.

Personally, for once I'm prepared to take Trump at his word:

When asked why he made the decision to go to war with Iran, the President of the United States gave us this: “The situation was very quickly approaching the point of no return and the United States found it intolerable, in my opinion, based on what Steve, and Jared and Pete and others were telling me.”

Based on what Steve, and Jared and Pete were telling him. He didn’t say based on intelligence briefings he had reviewed. He didn’t say based on threat assessments from the Pentagon or consultations with military leadership or authorization from Congress. He said Steve Witkoff, Jared Kushner, and Pete Hegseth told him it was time. And so America went to war.
That sentence should be on the front page of every newspaper in the country tomorrow. The President just admitted, on camera, that the decision to launch a military operation that has now killed eight Americans, over a thousand Iranians, and 168 people at a girls’ school was made because his son-in-law, his personal envoy, and a former Fox News host told him it was necessary. These are not military strategists. These are not intelligence officials. These are loyalists. And they are the ones deciding who lives and who dies.

 

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Are you under the illusion we are also not blaming Trump and only Netanyahu? We can do both. I blame Trump, I blame Hegseth, I blame Stephen Miller and I blame Netanyahu. It is an axis of evil, incompetence and stupidity that have led us into war and the brink of WW3.
Remember to also blame Chancellor Lord Vought who's partially paying the bill with funds pilfered from humanitarian support programs. He's successfully melted into the background after placing enough dancing clowns on the stage. I've not yet groked why he moved Noem to the back burner. Where he places her next is worrisome but that's getting off topic.

It is a humanitarian disaster. Israel knows exactly what the fuck they are doing. They want Tehran to be Gaza 2.0.
Hadn't thought about this. Trump resorts in Cuba, Gaza, and Venezuela make tourism sense. Does the Organization want one in Tehran as well?

Edit: oh no I see you're saying Israel wants to irradicate Iranians as well. That does seem to be the case. But I also see everything Trump supports in terms of the Organization making money.
 
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The difference between UAE and the US is almost everyone who lives there is from elsewhere. It's hard to see how a rich city can come back after emptying out if that is what it comes to.
Yeah, its also all very new isn't it? Like people go to Egypt as tourists to see the old Egypt stuff, UAE is essentially just a tourist trap amusement park in a desert.
 
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I don't get it, but they all seem to be fucking beholden to Israel. It makes zero sense, and America suffers at the whims of Israel.
We need Israel to get into a war with their neighbors so God will clear them all out and Supply Side Jesus can return.