Social Media and the state

WeFlossDaily

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"Every accusation is a confession." -- a popular comment on The Left about the relentless projection coming from The Right.
I can already see where this is going.
I'm sorry you fell for their bullshit. Both sides are not 'just as bad'. Political strategy think tanks like The Heritage Foundation WANT you to believe 'both sides are just as bad' if you're not on their candidate's side. They WANT you to throw away your vote so they can run weaker candidates against less opposition. And you fell for it.
I don't know what the Heritage Foundation is. Honestly, I don't. I refuse to play by the games of what I believe is a broken system. I haven't been tricked into anything. I don't consume large amounts of political publications related to America enough to allow either side to control how I think. If I want to look into an issue, I often look at how both side present it and how each side tries to demonize the other.
I'm sure you feel otherwise,
Yep.
but since you can't be bothered to vote, why should I care?
I choose not to, yes. I don't care if you care. It doesn't matter.
You don't have enough integrity to form an opinion in a way that makes it matter.
This is a judgemental and ignorant statement. It's also a personal attack. You are calling my integrity into question because my politics do not align with your own. It's a stupid thing to say to somebody and will be treated as such. To anybody who believes that I'm being unreasonably hostile to others, it's because of intentional insulting statements like this. No reason to be nice from this point onward.
So why bother? Attention? Well you got that. Maybe not the kind you were hoping for, but ... surprise ... you're not going to find a lot of sympathy here for people who just sit on the sidelines muttering "Don't blame me for this, I didn't vote!"
I don't need your sympathy.
This election was pretty damned clear. Project 2025 got a lot of coverage,
I have no idea what that is. I have mostly been following the events connected to Ukraine.
it has some heinously awful things in it. They WANTED you to believe that it was all B.S. and political theater, so you wouldn't take it seriously. And they wanted those that got -excited- to see those horrible policies passed to be energized into voting and donating to make them happen. Trump feigned ignorance (probably true, he's a lazy idiot who probably doesn't get past the cover sheet of anything handed to him), but people in his former administration were all over it. If you can't tell which party IS WORSE by now it's because you, like him are too lazy to make the effort to see through the BS peddled by the media they pay for.
Now I'm lazy.
The economy has been recovering well from the pandemic, inflation has tapered off, gas prices are back to what they were, unemployment is low, people have moderately affordable health coverage (a problem that's never been adequately resolved but it's better than nothing), we still have social security and a functioning post office. Let's come back and revisit this in 2 years and see where we're at?
Okej.
I can tell you right now that the threat of mass deportations is going to cause massive inflation in food, entertainment, hotels, construction, transportation, elder care... it's going to leave emergency services under staffed, its going to drive up healthcare costs.
I am pro-immigration. Your mistake here is thinking that non-alignment means I believe the opposite.
Trumps 'outlines of a plan' for healthcare will be to repeal the ACA, and with people cancelling plans, the premiums for everyone else will skyrocket. Home building will slow, stores and restaurants will close, unemployment will increase... if even a third of project 2025 gets implemented austerity is going to drive us straight into a depression. We have an idiot at the helm and we're heading towards icebergs.
I don't really disagree with this. I think we are fucked either way.
But, maybe you'll be lucky out there in your beautiful wild remote Alaska, sucking down our unearned federal tax dollars. Or maybe not, when Department of Government Efficiency Czar Elon Musk decides that Alaska doesn't help him sell his shoddy electric cars, so he cuts your funding.
This anti-Alaska bullshit igen. The federal government, and Canada, have already stated that they want to help California with the fires. I believe Los Angeles will be reimbursed by the fed to help enable them to fight the fires without having to worry about cost at all. And you are still whining at me about Alaska? Really.
Who knows what'll happen. All I can say is that I'm disappointed in you for not voting...
I couldn't give less of a fuck.
and why should I give a damn about any of your political opinions if you don't respect your own opinions enough to make them count.
I don't care if you do or not.
You chose to not be counted.
It's my right and my choice.
You're irrelevant.
I guess we are done here.
 
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Monica Dream

But spirit is something that no one destroys
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She may not know shit, but she's got strongly held convictions by gum!

If you're upset about aid to Ukraine then I hope you are happy about the results you've earned by sitting this election out.

You're proving more and more that you're an empty-headed idiot with only rage and grievances to offer.
 

Monica Dream

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Also, who the fuck says 'okej'? When I googled it I got results back that it's swedish. If anyone in alaska says it, they don't around me.

But you're alaskan, you say.
 

WeFlossDaily

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You may not believe it is as bad as I have stated ... but guess what? It is.
Seeing is believing and I don't see it.
Their leaders? On record, pushing violent, divisive rhetoric against people like me. Their followers? Look around you and tell me that it's just meaningless words.
My work place is diverse. I am known and respected among the people I work with for being both an atheist and for refusing to participate in what I believe is a broken system. Occasionally, somebody insists on praying for my soul, but that's about the worse of it. There is no discrimination against anybody for their race or their language or their gender. If we were to dive into it deeper, I think there would be some adversity, but I don't believe they would wish the other person ill over it. Or, at least, not any more than the boss. It's not perfect. But no, I don't think it's as bad as you say it is. Possibly the truth is in between both of our perceptions. Perhaps yours is skewed. Perhaps mine is skewed. I don't know.
I've been fucking lucky as hell to be at a stage where I still flocking pass in both directions. and lucky as hell that I have not run into one of the more violently opposed jackasses.
I can't really respond to this par. It's too vague. I will only misunderstand something.
Fuck sake I moved into a more out of the way area so I'd have a somewhat better buffer to keep my ass safer. I left a suburban environment wherein damn near everything was within less than a mile from my apartment to try and be a bit safer.
Try living in Ukraine. Missiles hitting Kyiv nightly. A full on war. Try living in afganistan, where women are treated like property and still sentenced to death by stoning. No matter how hard your life is and no matter how much you are struggling with and/or to survive or do anything, somebody else has it so much fucking worse. This sounds mean. But I'm serious. Do you live under a peaceful sky? Have you counted what blessing you do have? Have you seen how much worse it can get?

Do not fucking tell me that there are not people out there that actively want my ass dead for the oh so horrible crime of being Trans. Fuck there's a part of me that actually is starting to understand why one of my formerly closest friends in the area has started to go more militant in her mindset and is so fucking distrusting of people in general (let alone Cis people).
Not everybody who isn't a full-on American liberal hates trans people. I don't. Be yourself. But, yes, I am sure there are some people who do not understand and I am sure they are on the Trump side of things and I know they are wrong. Discrimination is ugly and nasty. But the left can be just as hateful as the right. I do however see your perspective, though. You've been on the receiving end of it. I didn't know that. I'm sorry people are assholes. I can understand why you'd take one side over the other.
What is happening to Ukraine is fucking horrible .... sacrificing a segment of the population because neither side gave them enough attention or aid (in your opinion/estimation) is absolutely horrible as well.
It really, really is. Yes.
And yes, I am aware you did not say as much - it is what it feels like however.

Do you know the biggest problem with revolutions? Putting aside how often they end up being bloody, messy mistakes - they can often end up with people unrelated to the issues being caught up in them and harmed (or killed/executed) and can more often than not end with an even worse set of leaders.
I know. I don't believe a revolution is going to happen anytime soon. But sometimes they are for the best, although it usually goes the way of getting worse it seems like, according to history.
I'll take the slower road.

I'll take the (to you) lackluster, lukewarm party whose rank and file do not want me dead and I'll take slow progress over no progress or sprinting in the opposite direction.
I understand the why part of your perspective at least.
 
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Soen Eber

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I do. It's not my fault if you are a monolingual sooka blyat.
Americans can't hop a train and be in the Netherlands for lunch, or make a weekend trip to Gothensburg from Bremmer, or rack up a work history that includes Norway, Iceland, Italy, and Poland, or hop a ferry for a drunken party weekend to stock up on lower-taxed alcohol in Sweden. For most of us, our only real shot at international travel and needing to learn another language (besides Canada and Mexico) is 4 weeks in youth hostels as part of a school trip when we're young, or making enough money to travel when we're in our 50's.
 
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WeFlossDaily

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Americans can't hop a train and be in the Netherlands for lunch, or make a weekend trip to Gothensburg from Bremmer, or rack up a work history that includes Norway, Iceland, Italy, and Poland, or hop a ferry for a drunken party weekend to stock up on tax-free alcohol.
Your right, most Americans most def can't. My Swedish is actually pretty bad, though. Cause I don't acutally need to learn it for any particular reason. I just like it.
For most, our only real shot at international travel and needing to learn another language (besides Canada and Mexico) is 4 weeks in a youth hostel as part of a school trip when we're young, or making enough money to travel when we're in our 50's.
I lived in Germany for a good amount of time but never really learned to speak it cause I didn't need to. Travel seems out of reach nowadays. =[
 

Jopsy Pendragon

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I can already see where this is going.
I'm not normally subtle, but I'm glad you got it without me having to spell it out.

I don't know what the Heritage Foundation is.
[...]
This is a judgemental and ignorant statement. It's also a personal attack. You are calling my integrity into question because my politics do not align with your own. It's a stupid thing to say to somebody and will be treated as such. To anybody who believes that I'm being unreasonably hostile to others, it's because of intentional insulting statements like this. No reason to be nice from this point onward.
[...]
I have no idea what that is.

Now I'm lazy.
Yep. Political nihilism is supremely lazy. You're uninformed, clearly not interested in trying to become informed. Yet you want to be heard as if your non-opinion deserves any attention at all. It doesn't. I

I am pro-immigration. Your mistake here is thinking that non-alignment means I believe the opposite.
Virtue signaling. Unless you're actually doing something for immigration (other than warming synapses between your ears), what you really are is "Not Opposed to Immigration" which is a null position. It's basically nothing.
 

Noodles

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Sure.

This is the hatred being spewed from one side. Then the other side spews their version of hatred. Both sides blame the other and avoid taking responsibility.
Please, enlighten us all with examples of hatred pushed by each side. For comparisons.

Be specific.
 

Soen Eber

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Please, enlighten us all with examples of hatred pushed by each side. For comparisons.

Be specific.
I would like to constrain that to hatred voiced by those holding positions of power and responsibility, who are public figures. It would be too easy to find examples from random people making random postings on the Internet.
 
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WeFlossDaily

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I'm not normally subtle, but I'm glad you got it without me having to spell it out.
I'm probably only half as stupid as you think I am.
Yep. Political nihilism is supremely lazy. You're uninformed, clearly not interested in trying to become informed. Yet you want to be heard as if your non-opinion deserves any attention at all. It doesn't. I
This is just more judgemental bullshit. It barely deserves a response.
Virtue signaling. Unless you're actually doing something for immigration (other than warming synapses between your ears), what you really are is "Not Opposed to Immigration" which is a null position. It's basically nothing.
Slow down. This is called putting words in somebody's mouth. It's part twisting what was said and part gaslighting. I intend to correct you for it and pretty much stomp what you said flat dead. Basically, your unable to accept that I am not against what you believe I must be against because you have been indoctrinated to believe and need to turn it around because I believe somewhat differently about some things than you do. You need to be able to attack it. So you've changed it into something else, and even went so far as to overstep and tell me what I think.

Because I'm in the middle of things, there's a lot of stuff I have no opinion on. Sometimes, my opinion swings completely to the left or right though. Sometimes my opinion is one that criticizes both sides. Sometimes it is apathetic or pessimistic.

As far as migration in concerned it probably swings to the left harder than yours. I've worked with a lot of Spanish speakers over the years and I consider the experience to be very positive. Some spoke English fluently, some struggled with proficiency and understanding, some barely, and some not at all. Most of them were hard workers, though. Especially, the ones who hadn't completed the immigration process. They traveled a long way, to a foreign land, because they believed it was worth it. English is not easy for Spanish speakers to learn. It's full of idiotic expressions and words that can mean just about anything. Imagine going to a new place and struggling to work in a new language and struggling to make ends meet. They don't travel north because they are lazy. They come because they are driven, motivated, and hellbent on making it. I admire this greatly and have found it to be very inspiring and humbling.

There have often communication barriers and sometimes I was the odd one out. Some of them were quick learners and caught on to English very quickly and I really liked how our mixed conversations evolved as we learned how to better communicate. They've never made fun of me for attempting to speak Spanish with them, I can barely roll an R, and often correct me nicely when I use a word wrong or out of context so I could learn. More than that, though. They were willing to put in a lot of hours of hard work. 14 hour days aren't shit to them. They want the money and the work and are often very determined to make it.

Am I actively doing anything to help them? No. But I hope that the people I've tried to talk to who tried to refuse to speak to me because they were scared to speak and mess up saw that it didn't matter to me if they used correct grammar and didn't care if I made a mistake. Some of the guys were so used to people getting annoyed with them that they didn't even want to try to learn or talk. I hope I made an impact on the people I interacted with. I used to get mad at the hospital security guards when they won't let them in, cause sometimes they couldn't explain why they were there or what they needed to do. But they knew how to do it.

They weren't hateful. They never complained or whined about work. They'd stop and help you if you were struggling to get something done. Have you ever heard about how music transcends language barriers? Well, so does work.

I wish I could speak better Spanish. I have no issue with this becoming a thing that I need to learn. I'm pro-immigration because I like the people I've met and befriended and worked with and thing that anybody would wants to come north should be allowed to. I think countries which don't allow immigration should be shunned by those that do. I want people to come here, to cross invisible lines drawn on maps, and succeed.

Next time you want to tell me what I think, reconsider it. You might be very wrong and end up looking like a judgemental. I might have several paragraphs to say about it. I can be a long-winded bitch sometimes.

Everything I experienced working with people who immigrated from another place, in this case, mostly Mexico, has been an overwhelming and extremely positive experience I wouldn't trade, as it taught me a lot about people that I couldn't have learned otherwise.

Should I keep going? This is one of those topics that irks the ever-loving shit out of me. I fucking loath how ignorant fucks treat immigrants and fully support them coming to where I live and working alongside me.

Probably this isn't good enough for you. Feel free to try to twist it around. It's a close second to the Ukrainian war. I can go on and on and on. And it's like I said, I might only be half as stupid as you think I am.
 

WeFlossDaily

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Please, enlighten us all with examples of hatred pushed by each side. For comparisons.

Be specific.
This is a really attractive piece of bait. But it's still bait. Read the thread. Or don't. It doesn't matter. The punishment on non-complete alignment with the majority viewpoint is often to be treated as less than human. I'm not trying to whine about it. I don't really care, and kind of understand why it's like this, but reading the thread would be a good starting place to look if you are want to see how hatred can be spewed by both people you disagree with and people you do agree with. There's quite a lot of it here, too. Some of it is completely my fault and some of it is people just being assholes because they are assholes. Just my opinion, though. It's not very popular.
 
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WeFlossDaily

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I would like to constrain that to hatred voiced by those holding positions of power and responsibility, who are public figures. It would be too easy to find examples from random people making random postings on the Internet.
I posted a video a several pages back as an example. I forget who got mad about it. But somebody did.
 

WeFlossDaily

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And five eye-rolls in a row from Govi.

I'll call for rescue to make sure you are okej and not having a seizure or something.

/me dials 9-1-1 . . .

911: Hello, what is your emergency?
Me: Can you send me a discount ambulance? You know, a cheap one. Nothing fancy.
911: A what? Why?
Me: I'm just trying to counter-troll somebody on the internet without being too much of a bitch.
911: You can't possibly be this petty.
Me: I can't help it.
911: You could just ignore it.
Me: She gave me five eye-rolls in a row.
911: Really? Wow. What a fucking passive-aggressive bitch.
Me: Yep. So . . .
911: She's probably fine. If not, who cares.
Me: Fair point imaginary dispatcher.
*click.
 
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Monica Dream

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Yep. Political nihilism is supremely lazy. You're uninformed, clearly not interested in trying to become informed. Yet you want to be heard as if your non-opinion deserves any attention at all. It doesn't.
"uninformed and clearly not interested in trying to become informed" -yes, so much yes. Absolute chef's kiss.