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Kara Spengler

Queer OccupyE9 Sluni-Goon
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Facebook is the worst platform for providing time sensitive info ie: sale on now! Come to this event for the next 2 hours!

Geez even all the rl events posted on Facebook get to me 2-3 days after the fact! Facebook tries to send you info it thinks you want to see at times it feels might be relevant to you missing out on that said event! It’s fucking useless for sl and relies on you breaking facebooks rules about using a known identity for establishing a presence there.
Yeah, I use it for getting info about an event. I never rely on it to tell me about things coming up.
 

Knutz Scorpio

Well-known member
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I'll be renewing my annual premium at the old rate just before the deadline and waiting to see what happens in the following year. Maybe during the next year there will be some new perk that'll make the new higher rate more worthwhile or LL will develop some common sense and back off on the hike or do it more gradually.
 
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Victorianna Writer

If all else fails...reboot!
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I did too and I have to say; the meltdowns and massive amount of whining, screaming, threatening to 'leave SL forever' and other outraged over-reactions people are having on SL FB have been quite entertaining. *edited to add: Most of this about the changes in groups, which LL walked back the next day. #virtualfirstworldproblems.

As for the rate hike, I don't understand why so many people are freaking out. LL is a for profit business. They were bound to raise prices at some point; especially since it's mostly us premium oldbies who are actually keeping the lights on. 🤷‍♀️

I went ahead and locked in the premium for another year on my main. I'll probably drop my alt to basic before the deadline since I'm not even using her land contribution right now. I'm really curious what 'new level' of premium they are teasing means too.
All my alts are basic since I don't have my club anymore I don't worry about having any of them on premium anymore just my main. I locked in too for the pre-pay.
 

Victorianna Writer

If all else fails...reboot!
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I did too and I have to say; the meltdowns and massive amount of whining, screaming, threatening to 'leave SL forever' and other outraged over-reactions people are having on SL FB have been quite entertaining. *edited to add: Most of this about the changes in groups, which LL walked back the next day. #virtualfirstworldproblems.

As for the rate hike, I don't understand why so many people are freaking out. LL is a for profit business. They were bound to raise prices at some point; especially since it's mostly us premium oldbies who are actually keeping the lights on. 🤷‍♀️

I went ahead and locked in the premium for another year on my main. I'll probably drop my alt to basic before the deadline since I'm not even using her land contribution right now. I'm really curious what 'new level' of premium they are teasing means too.
To me, unless I become rl friends with my sl friends, there's no reason to be on my rl fb...ya know.
 

Victorianna Writer

If all else fails...reboot!
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I'll be renewing my annual premium at the old rate just before the deadline and waiting to see what happens in the following year. Maybe during the next year there will be some new perk that'll make the new higher rate more worthwhile or LL will develop some common sense and back off on the hike or do it more gradually.
Mine renews tomorrow anyway plus I'm going to do the pre-pay to take advantage of the old rate and my main avi should be good till 2021
 

Porsupah Ree

Shy bunny
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Probably near London or SF
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Personally, I don't envisage this affecting me much. I certainly agree the hike was a jolt - there's no question they should have been nudging the fees up more gradually, not in one big lump. I also appreciate the Lab has their costs, of which hardware resources are only a minor portion - people's wages (and rents) aren't going down, especially in San Francisco.

For me, it's a nuisance, but not a dealbreaker. I'm on the oldbie L$500 stipend, so what had been a matter of getting the premium account at a modest cost to the lab now becomes about a $3/year expense to me.

Purely hypothetical, of course, given none of us - AFAIK - are in charge of the Lab, but: what would you feel would really make Premium worth it? For me - and I should emphasise I have no expectation this will ever happen - I'd be delighted if the land allowance were redeemable with private landlords, not just for mainland. Communities grow up way beyond the Lab's control or interest; being able to secure a plot where you actually call home in SL would be pretty neat. Some outstanding furry avs would be most cool, though TBH, I'll probably be rocking my now-vintage Kani until we're all sporting direct neural interfaces. =:)
 

Cristalle

Lady of the House
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Purely hypothetical, of course, given none of us - AFAIK - are in charge of the Lab, but: what would you feel would really make Premium worth it? For me - and I should emphasise I have no expectation this will ever happen - I'd be delighted if the land allowance were redeemable with private landlords, not just for mainland. Communities grow up way beyond the Lab's control or interest; being able to secure a plot where you actually call home in SL would be pretty neat. Some outstanding furry avs would be most cool, though TBH, I'll probably be rocking my now-vintage Kani until we're all sporting direct neural interfaces. =:)
More land allotment. At least another 512, but another 1024 would be ideal.
 

CronoCloud Creeggan

Redheaded
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I did too and I have to say; the meltdowns and massive amount of whining, screaming, threatening to 'leave SL forever' and other outraged over-reactions people are having on SL FB have been quite entertaining. *edited to add: Most of this about the changes in groups, which LL walked back the next day. #virtualfirstworldproblems.
A lot of folks weren't around when we only got 15. FIFTEEN! And that was also the era of having your prim hair show up attached to one's virtual hoohoo after a TP. Before Voice, Before Sculpties, Before Windlight, Before the Dark Times...Before M Linden.

But back then there were meltdowns and whining, screaming, threats to leave SL, claims that "whatever" would "Kill SL", and reaching for the pitchforks and torches over different things. When I joined, as a free account, which only a few months old at that point, people were still moaning about THAT. And over time Residents have moaned about Stipends, Voice, Sheep Search, Sculpties, Ratings, Dwell, the closing of the Teen Grid, the Openspace/Homestead debacle, the big layoff under M Linden, Child Avatars at SLB, Bay City, the creation of Zindra, various changes in the ToS, the removal of Third Party currency exchanges, removal of gambling, Adult Verification, Marketplace (and LL buying SLExchange and SLBoutique), the Tier Buydown policy, First Land, the Introduction of Linden Homes and Mesh!

And before my time there was the Prim Tax Revolt, and the creation of parcels, and the introduction of direct Teleporting. (the people who had bought valuable land near telehubs were PISSED)

You want to know one of the reasons why LL doesn't like to communicate with us? That^^, they've been burned so many times. LL could announce to tomorrow that everyone with a premium account gets a free region and a pony and you'd have someone saying that was a Tekki-wikki commie plot to undermine capitalism, free-enterprise, and the income model of mainland land barons in SL.

That said, it doesn't help that LL seems to have 3 internal cultures that don't seem to work well with each other. You've got the governance/decision makers, the tech-lindens and the community-lindens.

The Tech Lindens say: groups are SRSLY a resource Hog.
the decision lindens say: Lets reduce the number of groups Basic's have, that'll reduce the drain
and then the community-lindens don't seem to say: "Whut? don't you realize that will cause the residents to reach for their pitchforks and torches...again?"

When the real question the decision lindens need to ask the tech-lindens is "Why are they a drain in the first place? Why didn't you separate Land groups from social groups?"

And the tech-lindens will say: "Because we and early Linden culture was focused so much on sandbox culture and Land and the ability to build on it and not so much on the social experience. So we designed SL with OUR needs and the needs of the Crash Override/Hiro Protagonist types we wanted for our userbase. So groups are tied to Land."

"change it"

"we can't, not without more people...that M let go, and not without rewriting SL from the ground up, which would essentially break everything"

"Frak!"

As for the rate hike, I don't understand why so many people are freaking out.
Because they've been spoiled by it staying the same for over a decade...and the fact that 37.5% in one year is a BIG jump. As I've said, they should have been raising it little by little over that time.

I'm really curious what 'new level' of premium they are teasing means too.
Me too.

It's almost like you've seen this dance before.
All of this has happened before and all of this will happen again....so say we all. But you've seen this dance before yourself, Vicereine, as have most of us oldbies, FIC and near-FIC on VVO.

I wish the premium increase has been announced with the addition of the extra land and prims that happened a couple months ago. I think that would have made the increase more palatable.
Yes, I'm VERY surprised they didn't. But I'm not sure LL thinks that far ahead. I think they wander hither to and fro carried by the winds of chance and act in "the moment" not with foresight. This is why they didn't see the pent up demand for the Linden Homes in Bellisseria. Even the land based houses were all taken within a couple of days!

At this point, I feel like an entitled a-hole over complaining about the premium cost increase. I've enjoyed nearly 15 years of SL at the same price.
Yes, but as is being said, they should have had the foresight to raise it a little bit at a time over a period of a decade, not 37.5% at once.

Now that we will be paying more, LL should pull their resources back into their profitable product, and put Sansar on the back burner.
Sansar should go multi-platform ASAP, that would help...a little.


Like most of LL's announcements, it's ham-handed and more of a Marketing/PR failure than a real dick-move.
They keep making this same mistake over and over.

If LL had paired rate/fee hikes with the substantive enhancements they've made over the past year or two, far fewer people would freak out. Rate hike WITH EXTRA PRIMS! Rate hike WITH MORE FREE LAND! People need to feel like they're getting something for their money. By releasing those features to much fanfare months ago, LL undercut themselves. That was the perfect time to nudge rates up a bit.
Exactomundo! While the price increase made me go "ouch" I'm firmly in the camp of "they should have been increasing it over time!" And I am flabbergasted at why they haven't or why they didn't announce the increase at the same time of the prim and tier increase.

It's all about perception.
Indeed.

Purely hypothetical, of course, given none of us - AFAIK - are in charge of the Lab, but: what would you feel would really make Premium worth it?
2048 or 4096 tier, Xiola Linden and Strawberry Linden as my own personal shopping buddies...and a unicorn pony.

I'd be delighted if the land allowance were redeemable with private landlords, not just for mainland. Communities grow up way beyond the Lab's control or interest; being able to secure a plot where you actually call home in SL would be pretty neat.
yes, I've suggested that before, that one be able to donate their tier to one's favorite Ebil Land Baron to pay for a parcel from said Ebil Land Baron
 

Vaelissa Cortes

New member
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2007
Second Life's monthly fee is still cheaper than nearly every other MMO out there, even after the price change. Some people are acting like it's the end of the world, but I personally DGAF about a few more dollars. It'd just be nice if LL stopped being so terribly incompetent and misguided with everything they do.
 

Anya Ristow

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once I drop two of those accounts back to basic, they will lose the old 400L stipend, and my main will lose the 500L$ stipend. I won't ever bring these accounts back to premium at 300L$
Does this mean if I premium an Oct 2006 alt she'll come in at 300L stipend and not 400? It didn't used to be that way. My main re-signed several years ago and picked back up at 400. No more grandfathering once you drop it? Rule change?
 

Noodles

Queen of Ramen
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Does this mean if I premium an Oct 2006 alt she'll come in at 300L stipend and not 400? It didn't used to be that way. My main re-signed several years ago and picked back up at 400. No more grandfathering once you drop it? Rule change?
So, as I understand it. If your account falls within the date ranges for 500L and 400L, but has never been premium before, you will get that rate when you become premium.

If you drop being premium back to basic, then reup to premium, it will come in at the 300L stipend.

My main account was born 03/09/2006 and gets 500L$
I have an alt born 09/01/2006 that gets 400L$
I have another alt that was born 09/01/2006 that only gets 300L$, because at some point I was premium on that account for a month or a quarter or something. Even though it was created before the first alt above.
 
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Sid

Today's good mood is sponsored by coffee.
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Second Life's monthly fee is still cheaper than nearly every other MMO out there, even after the price change. Some people are acting like it's the end of the world, but I personally DGAF about a few more dollars. It'd just be nice if LL stopped being so terribly incompetent and misguided with everything they do.
It is not so much if it is expensive or not, when I wasn't premium I spend more on SL then now, but it is the fact that they make prices 37.5% higher out of the blue.
Would you buy a car that is exactly the same model, with the only new feature having different headlights, but 37.5% more expensive than last years car? Not me.
 

Noodles

Queen of Ramen
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SL may be cheaper than any other MMO, but they don't have nearly the overhead probably. No one is building new quests for people to play, with voice actors and cinematics. That's all user created and driven. Hell the SL advertising budget seems to be zero.
 

Beebo Brink

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SL may be cheaper than any other MMO, but they don't have nearly the overhead probably. No one is building new quests for people to play, with voice actors and cinematics. That's all user created and driven. Hell the SL advertising budget seems to be zero.
I'm not sure that's entirely relevant to us, as users. The cost of a product is tied to what people are willing to pay for it, not to what it costs the company to produce it. If people believe -- rightly or wrongly -- that a product is over-priced, that may reduce their willingness to buy it if there are alternatives that are cheaper, but if there are no competitors then it's "What are you willing to pay for this?"

A few years ago I would cheerfully have paid $100/year for Premium membership in SL. I loved the product, I used it daily, and the cost was well within my entertainment budget. Now, I can still technically afford it, but I'm less willing to pay it because I simply don't use SL that much.

What LL have done with this price hike is jolt users like me into asking "Is this still worth it to me?" instead of just riding along because it was easier not to think about it too much. For a thriving product with a constant influx of new users, the loss of some grumpy oldbies would be a worthwhile tradeoff. For an aging product that is not growing, price hikes can be risky.
 

Benjamin Opel

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What is the difference between Full Region and Full Region - Buy Down / Grandfathered? :oops:

 

Kamilah Hauptmann

This Reality Blows
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What is the difference between Full Region and Full Region - Buy Down / Grandfathered? :oops:

A decade+ ago, 195 was the price for a private region. (Grandfathered)
A few years ago, for a one time fee you could get a region with that rate going forward. (Buy down)
 
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Peony

The lurker in her natural habitat.
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When we got the doubled land inclusion I was pretty sure a price hike would be coming, but I had hoped they'd also introduce the various premium levels at the same time so that us consumers could make an informed choice. But this is LL, and they will do things their own way. I just find it ironic that they say they want to make land cheaper to own, but for me they've made it more expensive to own my little bit of mainland, even more so than when we only got 512 land with our premiums.

So I'm still not sure what I'm going to do with my premium avs yet. As a small time content creator and a merchant I'm getting a double hit with this announcement - pooling premium land entitlements has until now been the cheapest way to have an inworld presence for my stores (it's pretty much the only reason I have premium), but with this extra cost to cash out as well as a not inconsiderable increase in the yearly cost, I'm going to have to do the sums. At this stage I'll probably lock in for another year and wait to see what comes with the various premium levels.
 

sldenizen

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So, if I read the official blog post correctly, the only change for basic members is that the number of offline messages decreases from 25 to 15 per month. Did I get that right?

I don't use offline messages, but I won't let that stop me from writing a strongly worded blog post about this new oppression!
 
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Romana

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When we got the doubled land inclusion I was pretty sure a price hike would be coming, but I had hoped they'd also introduce the various premium levels at the same time so that us consumers could make an informed choice. But this is LL, and they will do things their own way. I just find it ironic that they say they want to make land cheaper to own, but for me they've made it more expensive to own my little bit of mainland, even more so than when we only got 512 land with our premiums.

So I'm still not sure what I'm going to do with my premium avs yet. As a small time content creator and a merchant I'm getting a double hit with this announcement - pooling premium land entitlements has until now been the cheapest way to have an inworld presence for my stores (it's pretty much the only reason I have premium), but with this extra cost to cash out as well as a not inconsiderable increase in the yearly cost, I'm going to have to do the sums. At this stage I'll probably lock in for another year and wait to see what comes with the various premium levels.
Was the double land inclusion for existing premium members? I didn't see an increase in my available land.