Nobody Cares: PRS

[Innula Zenovka]

Obviously you and I have different world views. Regardless of Tulsi, I do not think it is healthy at all for the US to be killing people all over the world for oil and domination for many decades.

It's not an either/or, though. The alternative to not getting your military involved in opportunistic wars for no good purpose is not to do away with your military but to use them rather differently.

Furthermore, one of the problems about being a colonial power is that it's a good deal easier to acquire your empire by military superiority and quite another to hold it together. But cutting and running carries with it several problems, as we're seeing at the moment in Syria -- the Kurds have been betrayed by the US and forced to turn to Putin for protection, and Erdogan is turning into a very unpleasant regional strongman who's making a considerable nuisance of himself to NATO and the EU in order to warn them off intervening when he goes after the Kurds on the Syrian side of the Turkish border.

And all the while, we have Putin and his avowedly fascist advisors and lieutenants planning the division of the world into regional spheres of influence, with Continental Europe being absorbed into a Russian dominated Eurasia (they don't want us Brits, though).

I know I keep on banging on about it, but I really do recommend that people take a look at Timothy Snyder's The Road to Unfreedom. Putin and his circle make no secret of their political vision of Russia's destiny, drawn from explicitly fascist and Nazi Russian philosophers of the C20th, and the section of Snyder's book that deals with their published views is really pretty chilling, as is the section that deals with their published views on cyber warfare and propaganda (a war they seem to be winning hands down, I fear).

 

[Salome]

And all the while, we have Putin and his avowedly fascist advisors and lieutenants planning the division of the world into regional spheres of influence, with Continental Europe being absorbed into a Russian dominated Eurasia (they don't want us Brits, though).

I know I keep on banging on about it, but I really do recommend that people take a look at Timothy Snyder's The Road to Unfreedom. Putin and his circle make no secret of their political vision of Russia's destiny, drawn from explicitly fascist and Nazi Russian philosophers of the C20th, and the section of Snyder's book that deals with their published views is really pretty chilling, as is the section that deals with their published views on cyber warfare and propaganda (a war they seem to be winning hands down, I fear).

Which is why it’s so incredibly frustrating and disturbing to keep seeing certain sects of the American left pretending like Putin is no worse than the US and parroting Russian talking points about their fuckery being no big deal.

 

[Isabeau]

Ive Been on SLU and VV1 on and off for over 10 years. I've read post after post on this board about how the US military budget is much too big, how it should be reduced, about how US health care and social programs and services/spending are lacking, about religious influence in your govt. it seemed to me that most of you also believed that even DEMs had slowly gotten closer to being centre/right (US) because the US right had become even more religious/extreme, bonkers.

I've been here all this time, reading about Bush, then the primaries with Clinton vs Obama, then the Obama years (when he wasn't able to achieve much of what he wanted because of GOP), the Trump election which shocked everyone including me. I remember before the election when a few people suggested that there was a strong possibility he could win, some got really angry at them, became even hostile.

And even though this board (I'm generalizing, you're all individuals, of course) has continued to express a wish that their country were more progressif/left leaning when it comes to social and economic issues, you are also trying to be pragmatic - everything can't be changed overnight, so you are trying to choose a candidate with the best chances to beat the republicans, etc.

I get it.

But it's Trump and everything that comes with him in office that is toxic. And this toxicity seeps into everything and everyone.

It's so hard to watch. I ignore threads, then un-ignore. I put people on ignore, then un-ignore. I leave a while then come back. Not because I do not appreciate different views or the subject at hand, or because I do not appreciate how difficult it must be for all of you, and not because of tone or anger, I just have a difficult time with all the contradictions. You think you know/understand what people believe, then bam! you see almost the opposite.

It's Trump. I blame him. He is the one that is toxic. That's the only way I can explain it to myself.

 

[Cristalle]

It's not just Trump. It's the GOP. One of my biggest pet peeves with the Democratic party is the fact that they like to follow this Cult of Personality to the point where they only brand one person as the problem. Trump is a symptom. Bush was a symptom. It's the enablers, the people who don't get any press, they stick around and make life miserable. We wouldn't have cockroaches like Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan hanging around for decades if people identified the problem correctly.

 

[Jolene Benoir]

I don't think that not wanting our military to start wars of aggression and not wanting to be Putin's satellite, even if it's not a physical war but one of compromised, Putin-selected Presidents is *(in)*consistent.

ETA: Typo, meant INconsistent.

 

[Salome]

“Republicans are horrible so I blame Democrats“ progressives are exhausting.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

New Jersey has a twitter account.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

Ive Been on SLU and VV1 on and off for over 10 years. I've read post after post on this board about how the US military budget is much too big, how it should be reduced, about how US health care and social programs and services/spending are lacking, about religious influence in your govt. it seemed to me that most of you also believed that even DEMs had slowly gotten closer to being centre/right (US) because the US right had become even more religious/extreme, bonkers.

I've been here all this time, reading about Bush, then the primaries with Clinton vs Obama, then the Obama years (when he wasn't able to achieve much of what he wanted because of GOP), the Trump election which shocked everyone including me. I remember before the election when a few people suggested that there was a strong possibility he could win, some got really angry at them, became even hostile.

And even though this board (I'm generalizing, you're all individuals, of course) has continued to express a wish that their country were more progressif/left leaning when it comes to social and economic issues, you are also trying to be pragmatic - everything can't be changed overnight, so you are trying to choose a candidate with the best chances to beat the republicans, etc.

I get it.

But it's Trump and everything that comes with him in office that is toxic. And this toxicity seeps into everything and everyone.

It's so hard to watch. I ignore threads, then un-ignore. I put people on ignore, then un-ignore. I leave a while then come back. Not because I do not appreciate different views or the subject at hand, or because I do not appreciate how difficult it must be for all of you, and not because of tone or anger, I just have a difficult time with all the contradictions. You think you know/understand what people believe, then bam! you see almost the opposite.

It's Trump. I blame him. He is the one that is toxic. That's the only way I can explain it to myself.

 

[Cristalle]

Keep twisting. It's not blaming the Democrats for making the Republicans as they are. It's the failure to identify the GOP as a whole as problem when trying to sell their own platform. By focusing on Bush incessantly as if he was the problem and not a symptom, we let scum like Ryan and McConnell get re-elected because the Republican brand and the illusion of fiscal responsibility survived. How is it that the country could give control back to the party that was primarily responsible for the financial crisis? Poor branding and media management. When Trump goes into the dustbin of history, we still have to deal with the deranged GOP. It's not "Bush's failed policies" or "Trump's failed policies" that we should be hearing but "GOP policies." People need to understand that the entire GOP needs to be voted out from top to bottom but Democratic messaging sucks. They're out there campaigning against Trump when they should be campaigning against Trump AND the GOP.

But then, they keep smelling their farts and acting like the country loves them. That's why the biggest block of voters was non-voters and the second biggest block is Independents.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

 

[Free]

What a shame.

 

[Aeon Jiminy]

“Republicans are horrible so I blame Democrats“ progressives are exhausting.

Isn't this really over-simplifying the problem?

I spent the majority of my life enraged at Republicans. What did that get me? It got me things like DOMA. Don't ask, don't tell. NAFTA. The repeal of Glass-Steagall.
Still marching against the Republicans as the 2000 election turned into a coup as we united powerless under horror to march into endless war with no resistance.
Bring on the Bankruptcy Bill. Bring on the Patriot Act. Bring on election fraud. Torture just might be a good thing. Torture? Really Nancy Pelosi? Still marching for Obama. The public option is off the table.WTF? More war. Detention Camps. Bank bailouts. Standing Rock. People of color being shot down in the streets.........
Still marching in 2016 until Bernie Sanders started talking about fixing the things I had been marching "for", not against. No, no, no. Look away. It's Trump!!!!! Hillary is the answer. No, I think Bernie is the answer. Hillary is the answer and Trump is the problem. That's final. Wait a minute, don't I get a say? Now you're the problem. Give me your vote. OMG you gave us Trump!!!!!!!!!! No I didn't, you did! Purge the Party! We have Russians among us! Give us Bush! Give us anybody but Trump!

This is a really condensed version. I'm a Democrat. I've been here all along. I've always wanted the same things. I don't want to kill people for my dinner. I want my taxes spent making life better and more secure for Americans. My door is open to a wide variety of people. I'm sick of making everyone an enemy. I want my piece of the pie and I think everyone should get their piece of the pie.

 

[Free]

 

[Jolene Benoir]

Keep twisting. It's not blaming the Democrats for making the Republicans as they are. It's the failure to identify the GOP as a whole as problem when trying to sell their own platform. By focusing on Bush incessantly as if he was the problem and not a symptom, we let scum like Ryan and McConnell get re-elected because the Republican brand and the illusion of fiscal responsibility survived. How is it that the country could give control back to the party that was primarily responsible for the financial crisis? Poor branding and media management. When Trump goes into the dustbin of history, we still have to deal with the deranged GOP. It's not "Bush's failed policies" or "Trump's failed policies" that we should be hearing but "GOP policies." People need to understand that the entire GOP needs to be voted out from top to bottom but Democratic messaging sucks. They're out there campaigning against Trump when they should be campaigning against Trump AND the GOP.

But then, they keep smelling their farts and acting like the country loves them. That's why the biggest block of voters was non-voters and the second biggest block is Independents.

Who here ever suggested that Republicans have not become a scourge upon the land? We, constantly point out their evil ways, the evil deeds that they do, and the ominous grip they have over a portion of the population, their gerrymandering ways, the fact that we cannot get a corrupt, treasonous creature out of office due to them, their denial of voting rights, in minute detail.

The main difference here, I think, is that you, and some others, would rather blame the Democrats for the existence of people who have seeds of racism, and misogyny which is exploited by the Republicans, plain-stupidity on the level of believing lies such as the trickle-down theory and vote those Republicans into office, against their own interests.

You want to act as if a man who conspired with a foreign entity, a man who attempted to blackmail a foreign entity, in the name of getting elected; a man who wanted to create electrified fences with spikes, an alligator moat and to shoot immigrants in the leg is just a symptom of, apparent Democrat misdeeds or that Dems haven't been able to deliver ponies in the face of serious Republican obstruction over the last 40 years.

I would add that you might want to direct some ire toward the Supreme Court, as well. Citizen's United and the gutting of the Voting Rights act had no small role in getting us where we are, as well.

 

[Jolene Benoir]

Speaking of voting rights:

Voter purges are on the rise in states with a history of racial discrimination

17 Million Americans Purged From Voter Rolls Between 2016 and 2018, Analysis Finds

The Brennan Center for Justice released a study Thursday showing that 17 million Americans were dropped from voter rolls between 2016 and 2018—almost four million more than the number purged between 2006 and 2008.

The problem was most pronounced in counties and election precincts with a history of racial oppression and voter suppression. In such areas voters were kicked off rolls at a rate 40 percent higher than places which have protected voting rights more consistently.

Following the Supreme Court decision Shelby County v. Holder in 2013, counties with histories of discrimination no longer have to obtain "pre-clearance," or approval from the Department of Justice (DOJ), before they make changes to voting procedures—allowing them to slash their voter rolls liberally, often resulting in voter suppression of eligible voters.

 

[Cristalle]

Who here ever suggested that Republicans have not become a scourge upon the land? We, constantly point out their evil ways, the evil deeds that they do, and the ominous grip they have over a portion of the population, their gerrymandering ways, the fact that we cannot get a corrupt, treasonous creature out of office due to them, their denial of voting rights, in minute detail.

The main difference here, I think, is that you, and some others, would rather blame the Democrats for the existence of people who have seeds of racism, and misogyny which is exploited by the Republicans, plain-stupidity on the level of believing lies such as the trickle-down theory and vote those Republicans into office, against their own interests.

You want to act as if a man who conspired with a foreign entity, a man who attempted to blackmail a foreign entity, in the name of getting elected; a man who wanted to create electrified fences with spikes, an alligator moat and to shoot immigrants in the leg is just a symptom of, apparent Democrat misdeeds or that Dems haven't been able to deliver ponies in the face of serious Republican obstruction over the last 40 years.

I would add that you might want to direct some ire toward the Supreme Court, as well. Citizen's United and the gutting of the Voting Rights act had no small role in getting us where we are, as well.

I am mainly talking about the leadership, the people responsible for promoting the party. Messaging is terrible, scattershot. Do you not understand what I mean by messaging? Are you responsible for the messaging? No. So don't read that as me directing it at you or people like you. Unless you're part of the Democratic Party leadership and strategists. Honestly, most Democratic strategists should be fired.

 

[Pamela]

Pentagon Concerned Russia Cultivating Sympathy Among US Troops

Defense officials say they are ‘actively working to expose and counter Russian disinformation’ as Moscow tries to ‘sow doubt and confusion’

www.voanews.com

46% of military families think Russia is our friend?

 

[Essence Lumin]

NJ has it's own twitter account.

 

[Beebo Brink]

46% of military families think Russia is our friend?

We're at war with Russia, but they're winning without bombs and military forces. We've become so focused on military strength that even when our own intelligence services describe what Putin is doing, there doesn't appear to be any general alarm that we're under attack. We're still stuck in a version of wars that involves bullets and feet on the ground.

The fascist strongman is an appealing archetype to our species in times of uncertainty and fear. For their own purposes the GOP has been stoking fear among its base for decades, and this dovetails quite conveniently with Putin's plans for global domination. Within that roadmap, Trump is just a transition figure, a useful idiot to be replaced with someone else. Putting plays the long game.

He's also using global climate change to his advantage. Russia is filled with land that is too cold to be useful, but in a warming climate would become more temperate. There are also oil reservices that would fund his grandiose plans for his lifetime and beyond. That other portions of the world would become uninhabitable isn't a concern since those areas are either poor and geopolitically weak or they are oil rivals.

What we're seeing now is that many Americans are more invested in White Christian identity than with the democratic ideals and rule of law that were the foundation of our country. However poorly we've executed those ideals throughout our country's history, they're still a much better model to strive toward than Putin's despotism. Women and minorities stand to lose a lot of ground under his regime, if not their lives.

 

[Pamela]

We're at war with Russia, but they're winning without bombs and military forces. We've become so focused on military strength that even when our own intelligence services describe what Putin is doing, there doesn't appear to be any general alarm that we're under attack. We're still stuck in a version of wars that involves bullets and feet on the ground.
.

I understand the general population not knowing that yes Russia is still attacking us, but the military??? Have they heard of NATO? Or the many sources confirming our elections were attacked by Russia? Evidently their training is sorely lacking.