Dems Need To Learn From the UK Election to UNITE under one message: GET HIM OUT!

[Anya Ristow]

You have me saying something about Clinton's reasons for not bowing out.

It wasn't me who said it.

Sorry. Fixed. And I had to fix *this* one before I posted it. Not sure what's happeneing.

 

[Anya Ristow]

Indeed there were plenty of other famous or important people at the dinner, but the only two Americans, I think, sitting at Putin's table were Jill Stein and General Flynn. Just a weird coincidence, perhaps.

Stein has said he wasn't there when they sat down. He joined them. And that there were no translators, so nobody spoke to him beyond greetings.

 

[Cristalle]

The report, I see agreed with a separate report by the University of Oxford, who have not yet (as far as I know) been suspended from Facebook for dodgy practices:

http://media1.s-nbcnews.com/i/today/z_creative/IRAReport17Dec.pdf

Russia favored Trump, targeted African-Americans with election meddling, reports say

The Russians set up 30 Facebook pages targeting black Americans, researchers found, and 10 YouTube channels that posted 571 videos related to police violence against African-Americans.

www.nbcnews.com

Indeed there were plenty of other famous or important people at the dinner, but the only two Americans, I think, sitting at Putin's table were Jill Stein and General Flynn. Just a weird coincidence, perhaps.

I'm unimpressed by the amounts spent and I am not so disillusioned in the American electorate to think that a few memes of outrage porn given to a small sliver of the population will swing an election. Far, far more money was spent by "legitimate" outlets to do that.

As for Stein, she said in a different interview that Putin didn't even stay there very long.

 

[Anya Ristow]

The report, I see agreed with a separate report by the University of Oxford, who have not yet (as far as I know) been suspended from Facebook for dodgy practices:

They were suspended from facebook after it was found that they created fake twitter accounts and facebook pages to make it look like Russians were meddling in the Alabama Senate race. When discovered, they claimed this was a test, and that since it was only $100K spent, it was too small an effort to affect the election. The same budget, in the much bigger presidential election, was the basis for Russiagate.

Secret Experiment in Alabama Senate Race Imitated Russian Tactics (Published 2018)

A project to help the Democratic contender, Doug Jones, in his closely contested race against Roy Moore used deception on Facebook and Twitter.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Cristalle]

 

[Romana]

The whole idea of anyone other than the orange one doesn't cut it. I'm 61 with no kids so I guess it doesn't matter if the world dies from lack of care about climate change for instance. Many other things need to be changed immediately looking out over the next couple of decades, maybe more or much less. Bloomberg and Hillary wish to just keep things going in their current direction which is dismal. Major change is important though and the current candidates are not providing radical solutions that are needed.

Well, I don't have any kids either, but I do have a nephew who's 17, and I do care if the world dies from lack of care about climate change.
Hillary isn't running, so went would you even mention her? Bloomberg isn't likely to get the nom.
But any Democrat, corporate or not, would be better than this destructive administration. Do you really think any of them would try to tear things down like Dump has?

 

[Essence Lumin]

Well, I don't have any kids either, but I do have a nephew who's 17, and I do care if the world dies from lack of care about climate change.
Hillary isn't running, so went would you even mention her? Bloomberg isn't likely to get the nom.
But any Democrat, corporate or not, would be better than this destructive administration. Do you really think any of them would try to tear things down like Dump has?

I brought up Hillary because she seems to be against any real change as shown by her anger with Bernie and apparently for her support of the firm making a mess in Iowa.

As far as what is good or not - Well none of them are going to make the least bit of difference for a hundred years from now. That would take a lot more forward thinking than is happening. So, whatever I guess. I'll be dead. My vote is for Bernie.

 

[Anya Ristow]

According to Bernie's people (Jeff Weaver, I believe), based on 40% of precincts in all four districts, the first count was 28% Bernie, 20% Pete, 19% Elizabeth, 13% Joe, 11% Amy. Final count 29% Bernie, 24% Pete, 21% Elizabeth, 12% Joe, 11% Amy.

Bernie's numbers, with 60% reporting:

@BernieSanders 29.4%
@PeteButtigieg 24.87%
@ewarren 20.65%
@JoeBiden 12.92%
@amyklobuchar 11.18%

Reports are that Biden is suing to prevent the Iowa Dems from reporting partial results today.

ETA Pete has released results of his own returns (only for himself, not other candidates) based on 75% of precincts. They agree with the vague results he used to justify his victory proclamation. They also agree with Bernie's numbers.

Which means that he proclaimed himself the winner knowing that he wasn't the winner. His victory speech seemed mealy-mouthed to me, which is why I reported it the way I did.

ETA2 or possibly it means he predicts he'll get more delegates despite Sanders getting more votes. That seems unlikely since there were only a few reports of the delegate math being weird.

 

[Dakota Tebaldi]

Meanwhile

 

[Romana]

I brought up Hillary because she seems to be against any real change as shown by her anger with Bernie and apparently for her support of the firm making a mess in Iowa.

As far as what is good or not - Well none of them are going to make the least bit of difference for a hundred years from now. That would take a lot more forward thinking than is happening. So, whatever I guess. I'll be dead. My vote is for Bernie.

Even if Bernie wins the nomination, and gets elected, the Dems would need a majority in both houses of Congress for him to have a chance of getting anything done. Whoever the candidate is will need that. I hope it's possible. And I hope if Bernie is the candidate that he can reach voters besides his ardent progressive base. The ones that think both sides are the same, or are discouraged, or even Fox viewers.
At least Bernie will try to reach beyond his base, unlike Dump.

 

[Dakota Tebaldi]

Hillary is retired. It doesn't matter what she's for or against anymore, or who she supports and who she doesn't. People talk like she's still secretly "pulling strings" at the DNC - seriously, no, get out of there. That's just Trump's exact "deep state" argument, reappropriated.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

Stein has said he wasn't there when they sat down. He joined them. And that there were no translators, so nobody spoke to him beyond greetings.

He speaks English, or he did back in St Petersburg. He uses interpreters in meetings, obviously, but he's certainly up to polite conversation on his own, particularly if there's someone else there who can help him out when necessary.

 

[Essence Lumin]

Hillary is retired. It doesn't matter what she's for or against anymore, or who she supports and who she doesn't. People talk like she's still secretly "pulling strings" at the DNC - seriously, no, get out of there. That's just Trump's exact "deep state" argument, reappropriated.

Maybe she doesn't matter anymore but she seems to try to in her backhanded way.

 

[Ishina]

Tulsi is/was dull, and being accused of treason by Clinton at least made her relevant for a moment.
Clinton is... I don't know what the fuck Clinton is. Desperate? Deranged? Mad that nobody cares about her anymore? Hopefully her endgame is more interesting than the build up.

 

[Cristalle]

Hillary is retired. It doesn't matter what she's for or against anymore, or who she supports and who she doesn't. People talk like she's still secretly "pulling strings" at the DNC - seriously, no, get out of there. That's just Trump's exact "deep state" argument, reappropriated.

Stop acting like she's irrelevant. That's like saying Obama's irrelevant now that he's out of office. No; these people have decades of favors built up and sprawling networks of influential people. Just look at how people here react to anyone saying bad things about her. She still has a lot of influence in the Democratic base, and lots of allies in the media, which is why she thought she could get away with saying these things.

 

[Dakota Tebaldi]

What she has is an opinion, and a lot of people who value it and a lot of people who don't. All those "favors" she has built up may certainly come in handy if she ever decides to run for an office again; but she is not running for any office now and neither does she have any DNC position so whatever influence she may have is incredibly limited, just like Obama's. Obama explicitly endorses Biden in this race and yet Biden seems to have made a pitiful showing with Iowa voters.

 

[Cristalle]

What she has is an opinion, and a lot of people who value it and a lot of people who don't. All those "favors" she has built up may certainly come in handy if she ever decides to run for an office again; but she is not running for any office now and neither does she have any DNC position so whatever influence she may have is incredibly limited, just like Obama's. Obama explicitly endorses Biden in this race and yet Biden seems to have made a pitiful showing with Iowa voters.

Obama has not endorsed anyone, so that is not true. Obama is not endorsing Biden, because Obama fears the same thing that we all do, that Biden will lose. Is a reason why he hasn't come out and supported his own vice president. When you look at cable news, a ton of democratic strategist and operatives that you see out there are all veterans of Clinton. Either her husband or her, and they have a lot of influence in the party. Stop acting like they don't.

 

[Brenda Archer]

Would you vote for Pence? Because he would be worse. And in the highly unlikely event that the orange one is convicted that is who we will get.

I don’t understand what makes you think I’d vote for any Republican for the next 30 years. Nor have I voted for one for President for the past 30 years.

 

[Spirits Rising]

So then, if your chosen candidate does not get the nomination, it was sabotage? And before you try and deflect that ... That is exactly how you're coming across. If that is not what you mean to say, then choose your words a bit more carefully.

Me? I'll vote for whichever candidate wins the nomination. And no, I have no favorite.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]