Dems Need To Learn From the UK Election to UNITE under one message: GET HIM OUT!

Innula Zenovka

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Indeed, but, just to be clear where the headline is potentially ambiguous, the overstatement concerned was about Russian motives, not the extent (or otherwise) of their interference or planned interference:

The US intelligence community's top election security official appears to have overstated the intelligence community's formal assessment of Russian interference in the 2020 election, omitting important nuance during a briefing with lawmakers earlier this month, three national security officials told CNN.

The official, Shelby Pierson, told lawmakers on the House Intelligence Committee that Russia is interfering in the 2020 election with the goal of helping President Donald Trump get reelected.

The US intelligence community has assessed that Russia is interfering in the 2020 election and has separately assessed that Russia views Trump as a leader they can work with. But the US does not have evidence that Russia's interference this cycle is aimed at reelecting Trump, the officials said.

"The intelligence doesn't say that," one senior national security official told CNN. "A more reasonable interpretation of the intelligence is not that they have a preference, it's a step short of that. It's more that they understand the President is someone they can work with, he's a dealmaker."
 

bubblesort

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Yeah, the Russia story is way overplayed. Even among Democrats, most people don't even care about the Trump-Russia story, let alone this new Bernie-Russia story. Being accused of getting Russian help just means the McCarthyist neoliberals don't like you. They will try to turn it into a way to deny Bernie the nomination at a contested convention, but that will backfire, if they do. I think Bernie will win a majority, so it won't come to that, but if it does, I have no problem voting Trump in a situation where Bernie wins a plurality but is denied the nomination by super delegates. I won't be alone in voting against an illegitimate nominee. It would be 2016 all over again if that happens. I might even register Republican if they throw my vote away. Republicans don't throw their constituent's votes in a shredder over super delegates. They don't even have super delegates.

The really important story right now is that the hippie love crystal lady just endorsed Bernie, LOL. He's got unstoppable love power now!
 

Jolene Benoir

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Hit the high notes. McCarthyist neo-liberals and threat to vote Trump. Doesn't matter that the people you call that are way, way to the left nor that if you were an honest person who supports Bernie because of his policies you would NEVER, EVER consider voting for Trump not to mention you'd be spiting your fellow Americans who desperately need Trump gone.

Fucking Bernie Bros begone and yes, oh yes, I am calling you one, as well as a few other things I will not mention.
 
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Arilynn

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Yeah, the Russia story is way overplayed. Even among Democrats, most people don't even care about the Trump-Russia story, let alone this new Bernie-Russia story. Being accused of getting Russian help just means the McCarthyist neoliberals don't like you.
:confusedcat:

So you are discrediting national intelligence a la Trump?
They will try to turn it into a way to deny Bernie the nomination at a contested convention, but that will backfire, if they do. I think Bernie will win a majority, so it won't come to that, but if it does, I have no problem voting Trump in a situation where Bernie wins a plurality but is denied the nomination by super delegates. I won't be alone in voting against an illegitimate nominee. It would be 2016 all over again if that happens. I might even register Republican if they throw my vote away. Republicans don't throw their constituent's votes in a shredder over super delegates. They don't even have super delegates.
1. The Dems changed the rules, in large part to accommodate Sanders’ demands, so superdelegates are out of the first ballot vote.
2. Superdelegates have not override voter preference since 1972, so it seems unlikely they would do so now, with all the criticism of superdelegates during the last election.
3. Why would you support Trump in any event? Do you think he will better the country with a second term?
 

Spirits Rising

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Ah yes, more and more at least one poster here shows that they'd have fit right in at Jonestown ... including the way it ended ...
 
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Pamela

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Ah yes, more and more at least one poster here shows that they'd have fit right in at Jonestown ... including the way it ended ...
More than one. See my Vote Blue poll — I didn’t think to add a vote Trump option, but about 20% of responses were that they would only vote for their favorite, no one else.

And that will be all it takes.
 
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Aribeth Zelin

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More than one. See my Vote Blue poll — I didn’t think to add a vote Trump option, but about 20% of responses were that they would only vote for their favorite, no one else.

And that will be all it takes.
I'm going to assume this was just a case of 'telephone' but that is not what the 20% voted for - the vote was 'Only if I approved' which mostly just means if the candidate is someone who is extremely problematical, then no vote.

But considering it was your poll, I'm dubious on the polite assumption.
 

bubblesort

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:confusedcat:

So you are discrediting national intelligence a la Trump?
Long story short, yes. I never bought into the Trump-Russia story. Sorry, but the facts don't add up. What I beleive is irrelevant, though. I wasn't talking about what I believe. I was just saying that I don't think most people care about it, one way or the other. I don't even think most democrats care about it.

1. The Dems changed the rules, in large part to accommodate Sanders’ demands, so superdelegates are out of the first ballot vote.
2. Superdelegates have not override voter preference since 1972, so it seems unlikely they would do so now, with all the criticism of superdelegates during the last election.
3. Why would you support Trump in any event? Do you think he will better the country with a second term?
Oh yeah, I totally agree with you, it's extremely unlikely to happen. I think Bernie will win a majority, but in the unlikely event that we have a contested convention, and then Bernie is denied the nomination after winning a plurality, then I would vote straight republican party ticket all the way down. It has nothing to do with Trump or even Bernie. I am no blue no matter who voter, but if somebody beats Bernie fair and square I'll be inclined to maybe vote for them, even if I think they are an ass hat.

I will only flip if the democratic party demonstrates that they are incapable of faithfully interpreting the will of their constituents. I already have misgivings about that, from their shady dealings in Iowa and 'jammed phone lines' crap they keep spouting on election nights (have they never heard of skype?). Throwing out the results at a contested convention would absolutely, unquestionably demonstrate that they are incapable of representing anybody but their donors. The clear message would be that they don't want or need our votes. So why give them any?

I mean, maybe you would be cool with your vote being thrown away for donors like Bloomberg, but I'm not. I don't think too many democrats would be happy about it either. I would not be alone in flipping.
 

Free

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Jesus fuck, does nobody remember the Trump hatred spurting out the Republican side during the 2016 primaries, and yet they somehow UNITED and bamboozled everyone into believing they were always there for him in the general.

We're still in a shakedown period. Give the whinging a rest.
 

Lady Darnk Juniorette

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Jesus fuck, does nobody remember the Trump hatred spurting out the Republican side during the 2016 primaries, and yet they somehow UNITED and bamboozled everyone into believing they were always there for him in the general.

We're still in a shakedown period. Give the whinging a rest.
You're gonna have to be a little more spuhsific, everyone is whining (myself included).
 

Brenda Archer

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If they’re referring to the culture war many of the older* voters are still stuck in, this tweet has a point. It’s just so totally poorly written they definitely had to take it down.

Not for the first time, it appears there isn’t someone in their campaign able to double check for tin ear remarks.

That’s really bad. But the way TV media portrays all politics as the culture war, and in the process ignores everyone who can’t even properly remember the 60s, much less be stuck in it, must be frustrating to young* campaigners.

*This cutoff point is roughly 50, more or less, which is to say a huge portion of the adult population are being asked to have an opinion on a culture war they weren’t there for, and exasperation makes sense in that context.
 

Arilynn

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I will only flip if the democratic party demonstrates that they are incapable of faithfully interpreting the will of their constituents. I already have misgivings about that, from their shady dealings in Iowa and 'jammed phone lines' crap they keep spouting on election nights (have they never heard of skype?). Throwing out the results at a contested convention would absolutely, unquestionably demonstrate that they are incapable of representing anybody but their donors. The clear message would be that they don't want or need our votes. So why give them any?

I mean, maybe you would be cool with your vote being thrown away for donors like Bloomberg, but I'm not. I don't think too many democrats would be happy about it either. I would not be alone in flipping.
Do you have the same misgivings about GOP efforts to suppress votes in states such as Kansas, Georgia, Wisconsin, Texas, Missouri, and North Dakota? What do you think about the fact that over 1,000 polling places have closed, nearly all due to GOP efforts? Or the GOP standing by as Trump lies, spreading doubt about the election system (“It’s rigged!) and attempting to intimidate targeted groups of voters? Do you remember his voter fraud commission (which found nothing, as did W’s DoJ) that wanted voters’ names, addresses, dates of birth, political affiliations, the last four digits of Social Security numbers, and voting history? And that states fought back, especially those with laws forbidding the release of even partial SSNs to decrease identity theft, while Trump and his lackeys kept chanting “voter fraud”?

How does all of that and more balance against your concerns about a brokered Dem convention? Isn’t what the GOP has been doing an attempt to “throw out” hundreds of thousands or perhaps millions of votes, and who do you think that favors, deep pockets or grass roots?
 

Brenda Archer

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Do you have the same misgivings about GOP efforts to suppress votes in states such as Kansas, Georgia, Wisconsin, Texas, Missouri, and North Dakota? What do you think about the fact that over 1,000 polling places have closed, nearly all due to GOP efforts? Or the GOP standing by as Trump lies, spreading doubt about the election system (“It’s rigged!) and attempting to intimidate targeted groups of voters? Do you remember his voter fraud commission (which found nothing, as did W’s DoJ) that wanted voters’ names, addresses, dates of birth, political affiliations, the last four digits of Social Security numbers, and voting history? And that states fought back, especially those with laws forbidding the release of even partial SSNs to decrease identity theft, while Trump and his lackeys kept chanting “voter fraud”?

How does all of that and more balance against your concerns about a brokered Dem convention? Isn’t what the GOP has been doing an attempt to “throw out” hundreds of thousands or perhaps millions of votes, and who do you think that favors, deep pockets or grass roots?

^^^^THIS^^^^
 
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