Coup in the USA?

Cindy Claveau

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My regard for fact-checking compels me to say there's no actual evidence in the linked news story to suggest quite what precipitated the unfortunate Mr Greeson's fatal heart attack, or what exactly he was doing at the time, but
I, too, was curious about the story. I found several links on sketchy news sites but no confirmation from fact-checked media. Of course, it's not like there aren't other points of focus on the whole escapade today.
 

Jolene Benoir

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I am obsessed and angry about the picture of the guy holding the huge confederate flag. As I said elsewhere:

Never forget just who attempted to commit an insurrection against our country; traitors that worship dead traitors. They see like in their white supremacist heroes of the Confederacy and Donald J, Trump. How dare they bring that flag into our house, the seat of democracy and freedom.

 

Innula Zenovka

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For the boys in blue who support this MAGA shit; they beat one of your own to death with a fire extinguisher.


Yeah, your "law and order" party. With your "law and order" president egging them on.
So how do US laws on joint enterprise work? I've read about cases in the US where (for example) the getaway driver in a bank robbery gets convicted of murder, when the victim was one of the robbers who was shot inside the bank by a security guard, since he was involved in the unlawful act (the robbery) which led to the death of one of the other robbers.

They presumably can't charge everyone who invaded the Capitol that day with murder (can they?), so who do they go after? Others who joined in beating the officer, even though they may not have struck the fatal blow? Others who stood and watched?
 
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Cindy Claveau

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So how do US laws on joint enterprise work? I've read about cases in the US where (for example) the getaway driver in a bank robbery gets convicted of murder, when the victim was one of the robbers who was shot inside the bank by a security guard, since he was involved in the unlawful act (the robbery) which led to the death of one of the other robbers.

They presumably can't charge everyone who invaded the Capitol that day with murder (can they?), so who do they go after? Others who joined in beating the officer, even though they may not have struck the fatal blow? Others who stood and watched?
From what I've read, murder charges would have to show compelling evidence that the accused actively participated in the crime. There are lesser "aiding and abetting" charges that can be applied otherwise.
 

Dakota Tebaldi

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My regard for fact-checking compels me to say there's no actual evidence in the linked news story to suggest quite what precipitated the unfortunate Mr Greeson's fatal heart attack, or what exactly he was doing at the time, but

Well if we're talking about irony, there's this information from The Daily Beast:
A woman who was reportedly trampled to death during a riot inside the U.S. Capitol was reportedly obsessed with the QAnon conspiracy theory, according to her friends and family. A photo shows that she carried a Gadsden "don't tread on me" flag at a protest before the violent siege.
 

bubblesort

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From what I've read, murder charges would have to show compelling evidence that the accused actively participated in the crime. There are lesser "aiding and abetting" charges that can be applied otherwise.
I am most interested in charges against Pentagon officials. The Pentagon took direct control of the national guard after the BLM situation in DC over the summer. It is their duty to refuse illegal orders, even if those orders come directly from Donald Trump. The entire strategic conceptual model the military follows fell apart when the capitol was stormed. It is an ancient model, with the government in the middle, surrounded by infrastructure, culture, population, etc, in concentruc circles.

If we allow that model to be violated for partisans, the pentagon is not fit for purpose. The democratic party will be forced to put the pentagon in their sights in ways that we have not seen since the 1970s, and the pentagon can not afford that right now, at a time when we are involved in little cabinet wars all over the world. This path ends with every service member being called baby killer in every urban center of the country, and it spreads from there.

A lot of generals have taken issue with civilian control of the military, but in the end, it is done this way for the benefit of the military. A standing army that has become an existential threat to one party or the other can not stand.

That is why we need to send generals to leavenworth for this. It is a question of national security.

I'm not hopeful that Biden and his demicratic parry will do this, though. I think they will fecklessly 'move forward', until serious, open, partisan conflict with the military is the only possible path forward.
 
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Fionalein

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It's all fun and games until you're arrested and charged with damage to (federal!) property, crossing state lines to commit crimes, rebellion and insurrection.
Did he do the walk of shame and hand over his sorry asses personal data at a police office in regret? Kudos if he did so, just trying to save his looser ass if he didn't.
 

Aribeth Zelin

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Oh, the poor babies - well, fuck their feelings.

[My mom can go hang, I don't want to be the better person - then again, she was never in a long term abusive relationship either, so maybe that's why she can say that.]
I should add that my mom and I agree overall, she just thinks we should keep the higher ground and well, sure, but in my cause I mean literally - make gravity work in our favour.
 

Fionalein

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Jolene Benoir

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Pence is refusing to consider invoking the 25th Amendment. On to impeachment, I say. But, Pence is still the tie-breaker, yeah?

 

Aribeth Zelin

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Pence is refusing to consider invoking the 25th Amendment. On to impeachment, I say. But, Pence is still the tie-breaker, yeah?

Yes, but at this point it is possible that a few of the sane republicans might actually do the right thing.....

eta: also, noticed the source if Faux and I don't trust them.
 
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Jolene Benoir

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Fionalein

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His days are numbered, he will forever be remembered as "that bootlicking evangelist sock puppet of Trump". That is if people will remember him at all, he just lacked traits that made him rememberable. Hell, the fictional character Wormtongue had more personality.