Nobody Cares: PRS

[danielravennest]

Why doesn't the USA just like, announce they're closing their borders?

Cos it feels like that's what they wanna do. It feels like that's the message they wanna send to the rest of the world.

We do a lot of trade and tourism with other countries. Most undocumented people in this country arrived legally, on a visa, and just don't go back. So if you want to "close the border", you would also have to stop all the business and tourist trips too. That's not going to happen. A lot of US companies depend on undocumented workers, either because they can pay them less, or they are the only ones willing to do those kind of jobs.

There isn't a monolithic "they" that want to close the border. I'm an immigrant myself, and don't have a problem with other people coming in. "They" are mostly old, white people from rural areas. They don't have experience with people who look or act different, and are therefore afraid of them. I grew up in New York City, which has dozens of ethnic groups and subcultures. Different doesn't scare me.

 

[Aeon Jiminy]

Sorry, but this is a piss-poor argument.

It is, in fact, pretty easy to claim just about anything, as anti-vaxxers have demonstrated.

What's sometimes difficult is producing some evidence to back up a statement, particularly when it's a negative one -- for example, how am I to know that there is not some profit motivation or political influence dirtying the keyboards just a little bit, and you're not making these claims because someone's paying you to, or has promised you some political advantage if you make enough of them?

Please prove to me that isn't the case -- I bet you can't.

Fortunately, I try to be both responsible and intellectually honest, so I accept that if I make any sort of claim about criminal, dishonest, underhand or unethical behaviour on someone's part, the person about whom I'm making the claims doesn't have to prove anything -- it's up to me to back up my allegations or innuendos with some facts, and since I have no reason to suppose you're dishonest or in someone's pocket, and certainly no evidence to back up such a suggestion, it would be irresponsible of me to make such claims.

So I don't.

Now, would you like to share with us the evidence that has led you to the considered opinion that medical professionals are cynically exploiting their positions of trust and betraying their professional responsibility to their patients by ignoring, for their or someone else's financial or political gain, persuasive evidence that it is not medically advisable to vaccinate children using the MMR vaccine in common use?

Here's what the NHS in the UK have to say to worried parents in the first instance:

Why vaccination is important and the safest way to protect yourself

Find out how vaccines work, what they contain and the most common side effects.

www.nhs.uk

Please review their advice and tell me where you think they get it wrong, and why.

First, I'm not saying that people concerned about vaccinations are right and I can't speak to how things work in the UK. I'm coming from a US point of view. I, personally, would trust the UK healthcare system more than we have here.

I have a lot of trust in doctors, healthcare workers, and scientists. In the US, there are money interests and political obstacles that can and have gotten in the way of making sure that research fluidly connects to healthcare providers.

I'm just saying that I understand fear when institutions with conflicted agendas starting ramping up public outrage on issues of public health. I've heard things like "manslaughter" and " dumped into the ocean" before and it didn't help the cause of stopping the spread of disease. It sometimes takes unbelievable patience and education to get trust. The goal is to bring these people in. I don't think that threats, labeling, and condescension is really the best way to do it.

 

[Cristalle]

 

[Katheryne Helendale]

First, I'm not saying that people concerned about vaccinations are right and I can't speak to how things work in the UK. I'm coming from a US point of view. I, personally, would trust the UK healthcare system more than we have here.

I have a lot of trust in doctors, healthcare workers, and scientists. In the US, there are money interests and political obstacles that can and have gotten in the way of making sure that research fluidly connects to healthcare providers.

I'm just saying that I understand fear when institutions with conflicted agendas starting ramping up public outrage on issues of public health. I've heard things like "manslaughter" and " dumped into the ocean" before and it didn't help the cause of stopping the spread of disease. It sometimes takes unbelievable patience and education to get trust. The goal is to bring these people in. I don't think that threats, labeling, and condescension is really the best way to do it.

How many children have to die before the deniers and skeptics get on board with the program? How much time should we allow them?

 

[Aeon Jiminy]

How many children have to die before the deniers and skeptics get on board with the program? How much time should we allow them?

What's the alternative? I just think we make the best choices we can, protect ourselves, survive, be compassionate, and try to set an example.

I honestly don't know beyond that. I'm definitely not the person to make that decision. Who is? Trump?

 

[Innula Zenovka]

First, I'm not saying that people concerned about vaccinations are right and I can't speak to how things work in the UK. I'm coming from a US point of view. I, personally, would trust the UK healthcare system more than we have here.

I have a lot of trust in doctors, healthcare workers, and scientists. In the US, there are money interests and political obstacles that can and have gotten in the way of making sure that research fluidly connects to healthcare providers.

I'm really not sure what you're saying here.

As I understand it, the official medical advice on vaccination programmes is pretty much identical in the UK and the US.

These things are based on international scientific consensus, not the priorities of particular national pharmaceutical interests -- we're talking about internationally-recognised standards on vaccines and vaccinations here, not about particular lobbies trying to get potentially lucrative new drugs approved in a particular country, or contesting attempts by a particular regulator to control their activities.

I'm just saying that I understand fear when institutions with conflicted agendas starting ramping up public outrage on issues of public health. I've heard things like "manslaughter" and " dumped into the ocean" before and it didn't help the cause of stopping the spread of disease. It sometimes takes unbelievable patience and education to get trust. The goal is to bring these people in. I don't think that threats, labeling, and condescension is really the best way to do it.

Some people in internet forums use wild exaggeration to express the strength of their feelings on particular topics. That's nothing new. It's not something I often do myself, or at least I try not to, but I don't think anyone who posts here threatening ludicrously grotesque violence for one moment expects their words to be taken literally.

 

[Tracer]

 

[Veritable Quandry]

It sometimes takes unbelievable patience and education to get trust. The goal is to bring these people in.

If they were just killing themselves, I would say fine, let's just let them do their thing. But they are harming other people with their paranoid ignorant bullshit. Fuck patience and understanding. And especially fuck rich assholes with access to health care spreading it to vulnerable people.

 

[Brenda Archer]

We do a lot of trade and tourism with other countries. Most undocumented people in this country arrived legally, on a visa, and just don't go back. So if you want to "close the border", you would also have to stop all the business and tourist trips too. That's not going to happen. A lot of US companies depend on undocumented workers, either because they can pay them less, or they are the only ones willing to do those kind of jobs.

There isn't a monolithic "they" that want to close the border. I'm an immigrant myself, and don't have a problem with other people coming in. "They" are mostly old, white people from rural areas. They don't have experience with people who look or act different, and are therefore afraid of them. I grew up in New York City, which has dozens of ethnic groups and subcultures. Different doesn't scare me.

Yes.

We have a lot of regions where an immigrant population is a substantial large minority. We have a lot of people who are descended from mixtures that include the reviled immigrants of their day. I keep coming across really arrogant bigots here in Arizona who can somehow tell I’m not one of them (so weird to me, I thought I looked Celtic) and get mad when they don’t get deference. I assume they’re mostly fundies and they’re actually a minority, but their heads are full of bad histories and preaching that makes them the chosen settlers of God. Now they realize everyone else is tired of their horseshit (including plenty of people coded white) they’re getting very angry and frankly dangerous. Most of us are sick of them. They only have control of the government because the Senate and Electoral College don’t reflect majority rule. Actual majority rule looks like the House.

 

[Dakota Tebaldi]

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

What's the alternative? I just think we make the best choices we can, protect ourselves, survive, be compassionate, and try to set an example.

Vaccination enforcement by law like some countries recently reintroduced again for the measles. End of story.

 

[Dakota Tebaldi]

This is pandering of course; but, well, I can't really disagree with it.

 

[Argent Stonecutter]

At the end of the day, nobody can plant their flag on a hill and claim that there isn't some profit motivations and political influence dirtying the needles just a little bit.

I'm so sorry to hear you say that.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

Thread starts out as a thing about a specific American politician and not quite entirely American problem, and morphs into something about toxic abuse culture.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

 

[Cristalle]

Interesting interview with Bill Weld, Republican presidential candidate and former Massachusetts Governor.

 

[Cristalle]

This looks at the increasing death rate of people in their prime working years and pegs it to Reagan, since this trend started in the 80s.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

Saturday Morning Breakfast Cereal - Dear

Saturday Morning Breakfast Cereal - Dear

www.smbc-comics.com

 

[Essence Lumin]

Dave's not here.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

Grumpy Cat toy by YuliaLeonovich on DeviantArt

www.deviantart.com