Dems Need To Learn From the UK Election to UNITE under one message: GET HIM OUT!

Zaida Gearbox

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So everything Trump has done and said is ok? I can't imagine any human with a conscience not feeling this way...
I didn't say that. I just thought the behavior of the supposed newscasters was appalling. They could have just reported the facts and let the people watching decide what they think and feel about the information.
 
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Eunoli

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I think we are talking past each other. I'm not disputing Russia interferes with American politics. I am absolutely sure that their influence goes deep into the politics and buisness of other nations, and that their methods are sophisticated. I'm not stupid.
We are, somewhat. Thanks for pointing that out. But, I still disagree with you about the influence of social media on public opinion. Still, I misunderstood your first post.
 

Brenda Archer

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This "bot" argument is designed to delegitimize certain voters and control the narrative. Well, attacking voters is a dumb idea and you are not going to win by trying to shame people into accepting a shit sandwich.
Dude, we can SEE the bots on Twitter.

Seeing them is not a claim about who is running them.

We *don't know* who is running them and shouldn’t pretend we do.

But that they’re bots, we have no doubt. Just like the example I linked.

This is because platforms like Twitter don’t require all the users to be authenticated as real people (which would make it impossible for people who need the safety of anonymity to use the platform).
 
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NyteWytch

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I didn't say that. I just thought the behavior of the supposed newscasters was appalling. They could have just reported the facts and let the people watching decide what they think and feel about the information.
You know what is appalling? What that buffoon has done to democracy. What he has chosen to do to children, those who are in unfortunate circumstances, those with very little. You know what fucking turns my stomach? That voters and Republican politicians in this fucking country will sit by and wring their pearls over "fake news" instead of choosing to do right by fucking humans in need.
 
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Cristalle

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You know what is appalling? What that buffoon has done to democracy. What he has chosen to do to children, those who are in unfortunate circumstances, those with very little. You know what fucking turns my stomach? That voters and Republican politicians in this fucking country will sit by and wring their pearls over "fake news" instead of choosing to do right by fucking humans in need.
So why isn't it appalling that the supposed left leaning network has someone shilling for the fascist? Can't both things be wrong?
 
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Romana

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When I have time I'll look for another take on that story, I couldn't get too far into that one without being inundated by pro-Dump ads and pleas "to help save conservative journalism". I think the author of that article might be a tiny bit biased.
That's not to say that MSNBC aren't being assholes. So are a lot of other networks. Like one called Newsmax, which runs all the barf-worthy right-wing pundits they can fit, and had programs with names like "Dummycrats". I am so glad I can finally hide these channels from view (even if it's only to me).
 
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Aeon Jiminy

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Beau talking sense again.

This was an interesting take. I've been trying to assemble an answer to a question posed by Innula Zenovka and I can't. You know you wanna try to keep your duckies in a row when you talk to Innula ;). I dread anything Russia being introduced into this primary. It's a nuclear distraction. I just want to snuff it out. The most important thing is knowing your goal and achieving it fairly to the best of your abilities. Anyone who is trying to lie, take advantage, steal, and manipulate you to hurt yourself for their own interests, is a bad actor. They're people. Giving them evil superpowers is giving your own power away. Same goes for Trump.
 

Romana

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This was an interesting take. I've been trying to assemble an answer to a question posed by Innula Zenovka and I can't. You know you wanna try to keep your duckies in a row when you talk to Innula ;). I dread anything Russia being introduced into this primary. It's a nuclear distraction. I just want to snuff it out. The most important thing is knowing your goal and achieving it fairly to the best of your abilities. Anyone who is trying to lie, take advantage, steal, and manipulate you to hurt yourself for their own interests, is a bad actor. They're people. Giving them evil superpowers is giving your own power away. Same goes for Trump.
Please clarify "Russia being introduced into this primary". Do you mean in discussion? Because if they're there (and they almost certainly are), ignoring the fact helps no one. They are one of several elephants in the room. But there's destructive discussion and constructive discussion. The latter is needed on everything.
 
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Aeon Jiminy

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Please clarify "Russia being introduced into this primary". Do you mean in discussion? Because if they're there (and they almost certainly are), ignoring the fact helps no one. They are one of several elephants in the room. But there's destructive discussion and constructive discussion. The latter is needed on everything.
Yea, I kind of think talking about their influence at this point is fruitless. If, out of the blue, we open a "Russian influence" dialog about a specific candidate in major media outlets on the day before an important election event, then it's not really the Russian influence that's influencing opinion nearly as much as the person talking about it. Talking about Russian influence for 3 1/2 years hasn't changed anything. It's been a circular firing squad.
 

Romana

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Yea, I kind of think talking about their influence at this point is fruitless. If, out of the blue, we open a "Russian influence" dialog about a specific candidate in major media outlets on the day before an important election event, then it's not really the Russian influence that's influencing opinion nearly as much as the person talking about it. Talking about Russian influence for 3 1/2 years hasn't changed anything. It's been a circular firing squad.
I have to disagree. This situation is different.
If it is discussed, it may be easier to tell how much of Bernie's supporters who are being so vocal are genuine. That can only help Bernie, residually side the trolls won't stop trolling.
If it isn't discussed, there will always be that doubt.
And after all, Bernie brought the subject up himself.
 
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Innula Zenovka

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Yea, I kind of think talking about their influence at this point is fruitless. If, out of the blue, we open a "Russian influence" dialog about a specific candidate in major media outlets on the day before an important election event, then it's not really the Russian influence that's influencing opinion nearly as much as the person talking about it. Talking about Russian influence for 3 1/2 years hasn't changed anything. It's been a circular firing squad.
The problem is that when the leading candidate says, unprompted, he was told about a month previously by "US officials" (I assume they were speaking in an official capacity) that Russia has been trying to influence the campaign on his behalf, it's a bit difficult to ignore it, even though there's apparently no evidence to support the claim.

What are people supposed to say? "Oh, it's just Bernie being Bernie. He gets these daft ideas sometimes. Best ignore him?"
 

Aeon Jiminy

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The problem is that when the leading candidate says, unprompted, he was told about a month previously by "US officials" (I assume they were speaking in an official capacity) that Russia has been trying to influence the campaign on his behalf, it's a bit difficult to ignore it, even though there's apparently no evidence to support the claim.

What are people supposed to say? "Oh, it's just Bernie being Bernie. He gets these daft ideas sometimes. Best ignore him?"
Oh God, Innula, you're gonna make me have to research this. You're correct.

Apologies to you, Dakota, Romana, and all of the victims of my ignorance. It's completely fair game for discussion. He's inviting it.

I don't understand his motivations for doing this, but I'm not winning any campaign either.

So one more time, I'm 100% off base about a topic that is ripe for discussion.

I'm going to go sulk in the WRONG CORNER for awhile and punish myself by going to WalMart.

 

Romana

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Oh God, Innula, you're gonna make me have to research this. You're correct.

Apologies to you, Dakota, Romana, and all of the victims of my ignorance. It's completely fair game for discussion. He's inviting it.

I don't understand his motivations for doing this, but I'm not winning any campaign either.

So one more time, I'm 100% off base about a topic that is ripe for discussion.

I'm going to go sulk in the WRONG CORNER for awhile and punish myself by going to WalMart.

Maybe someone did tell him that.
He wouldn't just make it up. Why open that can of worms if he didn't have to?
 
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Innula Zenovka

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Maybe someone did tell him that.
He wouldn't just make it up. Why open that can of worms if he didn't have to?
I now discover, having read the Snopes article more closely, that
Sanders appeared to suggest there was a political motive to the timing of the revelations, which were first reported by The Washington Post.

“One day before the Nevada caucus, why do you think it came out?” he said, adding sarcastically: “It was The Washington Post? Good friends.”
 
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Cristalle

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The problem is that when the leading candidate says, unprompted, he was told about a month previously by "US officials" (I assume they were speaking in an official capacity) that Russia has been trying to influence the campaign on his behalf, it's a bit difficult to ignore it, even though there's apparently no evidence to support the claim.

What are people supposed to say? "Oh, it's just Bernie being Bernie. He gets these daft ideas sometimes. Best ignore him?"
It wasn't "unprompted," it was in response to a question from a reporter. I saw a snippet of the the interview and saw the question being asked.
 
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