Brexit.

[Sid]

I don't think that rejoining the single market with conditions will be possible ever again.
If the UK wants to return, the stupidest idea the EU could have is to make a special snow flake out of the UK (again).
IMHO: full member (including the euro as currency) or nothing. No ifs and buts.
Ellwood stil doesn't get it: The EU doesn't work like a supermarket, where you can pick that what you like and leave the rest on the shelves.

 

[Aribeth Zelin]

I don't think that rejoining the single market with conditions will not be possible ever again.
If the UK wants to return, the supidest idea the EU could have is to make special snow flakes out of the UK (again).
IMHO: full member (including the euro as currency) or nothing. No ifs and buts.
Ellwood stil doesn't get it: The EU doesn't work like a supermarket, where you can pick that what you like and leave the rest on the shelves.

The only thing I hope is, if Scotland breaks from the UK they will be given expedited membership, since they didn't want to leave in the first place.
They probably wouldn't mind giving up the pound at that point either, honestly.

I do have a question - in the EU, do countries still also use their national currency with the Euro? Or does it become a historical collectors item sort of thing?

 

[WolfEyes]

Ummm.... 454 grams is just shy of a half kilo, which we in America only use to measure drugs. But that's 16 ounces aka a full pound.

Has Aldi's been losing money over there?

A kilo is 2.2 pounds.

Disclaimer: I have never purchased more than 2.2 kilos of buds at one time.

 

[Tirellia]

The only thing I hope is, if Scotland breaks from the UK they will be given expedited membership, since they didn't want to leave in the first place.
They probably wouldn't mind giving up the pound at that point either, honestly.

I do have a question - in the EU, do countries still also use their national currency with the Euro? Or does it become a historical collectors item sort of thing?

Fuck the Scottish National Socialist Party and its ludicrous separatist agenda with a deep fried haggis. Why some people think that Brexit was bad but Joxit would be good I have no idea. Some stupid romantic Willy Wallace "freedumb!" call or what? Many of us in the UK voted remain but we are obliged to leave. Many people in Scotland voted to remain in the UK and remain in the EU. Why should each of them be obliged to suffer leaving both?

Not every country in the EU uses the Euro. Bulgaria, Croatia, Czech Republic, Denmark, Hungary, Poland, Romania and Sweden. It is expected that new EU members will try to join the Eurozone but it hasn't been compulsory.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

I simply don't understand how the SNP think it would work with an independent Scotland as part of the single market, with England and Wales outside it. You'd need Dover/Calais style documentation and customs checks at the border, particularly for moving food and drink between the two jurisdictions.

Hard border would be created with England if independent Scotland joined EU

A hard border with England would be created for the first time in three centuries if an independent Scotland joined the European Union, a think-tank has warned.

www.scotsman.com

Scotland faces border checks with England if it rejoins the EU - think tank

Scotland will need checkpoints along its border with England for the first time in more than three centuries if it votes for independence and rejoins the European Union, according to a think tank report published on Thursday.

www.reuters.com

It would play havoc with the supermarkets' distribution system, and forget nipping across the border to do your weekly supermarket shop.

 

[Sid]

Not every country in the EU uses the Euro. Bulgaria, Croatia, Czech Republic, Denmark, Hungary, Poland, Romania and Sweden. It is expected that new EU members will try to join the Eurozone but it hasn't been compulsory.

All mentioned countries have agreed to implement the Euro in the future, but they have their own pace to implement it.
Only Denmark is an exception. They have demanded the right to keep their own currency in the future.
For new entering countries it is mandatory to implement the Euro, but they are granted time to meet the economic rules from the Euro zone.

Sweden and Hungary are not that keen to get the Euro, so that will be a while for that happens.
Croatia will be next country to implement the Euro soon.

And to answer Aribeth's question: The countries in the Euro Zone don't have an own currency any longer only the Euro. So the Dutch Guilder, the German Marks, the French and Belgium Francs, the Italian Lira etc are all history.
It looks all a bit complicated, but remember the EU is not a country but 27 countries working closely together. That can only be done with a lot of compromises.

 

[Sid]

I simply don't understand how the SNP think it would work with an independent Scotland as part of the single market, with England and Wales outside it. You'd need Dover/Calais style documentation and customs checks at the border, particularly for moving food and drink between the two jurisdictions.

Hard border would be created with England if independent Scotland joined EU

A hard border with England would be created for the first time in three centuries if an independent Scotland joined the European Union, a think-tank has warned.

www.scotsman.com

Scotland faces border checks with England if it rejoins the EU - think tank

Scotland will need checkpoints along its border with England for the first time in more than three centuries if it votes for independence and rejoins the European Union, according to a think tank report published on Thursday.

www.reuters.com

It would play havoc with the supermarkets' distribution system, and forget nipping across the border to do your weekly supermarket shop.

If Scotland had land borders with other countries it would be much easier to break away from the UK, if desired.
But how the situation is, I think that Scotland is at least economically better of in an union with the UK.

 

[Aribeth Zelin]

All mentioned countries have agreed to implement the Euro in the future, but they have their own pace to implement it.
Only Denmark is an exception. They have demanded the right to keep their own currency in the future.
For new entering countries it is mandatory to implement the Euro, but they are granted time to meet the economic rules from the Euro zone.

Sweden and Hungary are not that keen to get the Euro, so that will be a while for that happens.
Croatia will be next country to implement the Euro soon.

And to answer Aribeth's question: The countries in the Euro Zone don't have an own currency any longer only the Euro. So the Dutch Guilder, the German Marks, the French and Belgium Francs, the Italian Lira etc are all history.
It looks all a bit complicated, but remember the EU is not a country but 27 countries working closely together. That can only be done with a lot of compromises.

Okay, I was wondering.

I get the concept, its more or less who the US started at the very beginning. And I really wish we had real compromise in this country but one party has been taken over by, among other things, religious fanatics who refuse to budge an inch, except further away from compromise.

And I guess it does make sense, but I know this wouldn't be the first time Scotland considered separating, and honestly, from the outside, it feels like Brexit was done by appealing to the nationalism of being 'English' not British, so I could see why the other chunks of Britain might want free from it.

 

[Sid]

And I guess it does make sense, but I know this wouldn't be the first time Scotland considered separating, and honestly, from the outside, it feels like Brexit was done by appealing to the nationalism of being 'English' not British, so I could see why the other chunks of Britain might want free from it.

Their position on the world map is not really helping Scotland.
When Scotland would break with the UK, they join the EU again, that in itself can be done quite swiftly, but then what?
The EU's single market is far away. Only Norway is close and Ireland, but both only directly accessible over water.
That would need a few big harbors and not only in Scotland. And a lot of extra ships. To accomplish that would take years.

Transport over land would become very difficult with 2 border crossings in and out of England with all the paperwork needed.
Delays in Dover and delays at the Scottish border.
I don't think that the TIR rules are in place between the EU, England and Scotland.

Voting for independence is the easy part of the plan, but the sea infrastructure needed is simply not there.

 

[Argent Stonecutter]

#occupydoggerland

 

[Innula Zenovka]

‘Complete nonsense’: Asda boss mocks post-Brexit plan to return to imperial measures

Tory peer Lord Rose criticises ‘backwards’ proposal as business department launches 12-week consultation

www.theguardian.com

Evernote link

 

[Innula Zenovka]

Thread

 

[Sid]

If you reinstall economical borders, it costs time delay and money.
One doesn't have to study economics or have a business to understand that IMHO.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

 

[Sid]

Well, for all the Britons that are not amused with the delays due to Brexit.
Here a picture of the delays due to corona in one of the departure halls at the Dutch national airport Schiphol:

Some managers reckoned it would be a great cost saving idea to lay of the surplus off workers during the corona crisis. A lot of them worked as free lancers or with a 0 hour contract (meaning no guaranteed working hours).
Only thing they did not participate on, was that economy would start booming right after the corona crises and therefor we have a shortage of workers and craftsmen all over the country.
So most of the sacked Schiphol employees found (better payed) work elsewhere and Schiphol will be this problematic at least the next couple of months. Luggage and security scans are the main bottlenecks.
A lot of flights are delayed and several flights are canceled altogether because they missed their departure time slots. A lot of passengers stranded every day.
Who cares about a passport check?

 

[Innula Zenovka]

Well, for all the Britons that are not amused with the delays due to Brexit.
Here a picture of the delays due to corona in one of the departure halls at the Dutch national airport Schiphol:

Some managers reckoned it would be a great cost saving idea to lay of the surplus of workers during the corona crisis. A lot of them worked as free lancers or with a 0 hour contract (meaning no guaranteed work).
Only thing they did not participate on, was that economy would start booming right after the corona crises and therefor we have a shortage of workers and craftsmen all over the country.
So most of the sacked Schiphol employees found (better payed) work elsewhere and Schiphol will be this problematic at least the next couple of months. Luggage and security scans are the main bottlenecks.
A lot of flights are delayed and several flights are canceled altogether because they missed their departure time slots. A lot of passengers stranded every day.
Who cares about a passport check?

We've got that here, too

Minister was warned staff crisis would lead to ‘inevitable’ travel chaos, says aviation union

Call predicted airlines would fail to cope with huge demand as hostilities between government and industry deepen over appeal for special visas for EU workers

www.theguardian.com

Evernote link

 

[Stora]

I remember it was the travel industry that seemed to be shouting the loudest about lifting travel restrictions and yet they are unprepared when those same restrictions are being lifted.

You can't just lay off 50% of your staff and expect to fill those positions again overnight, for one air side security clearance can take a while to process all the background checks.

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

Their position on the world map is not really helping Scotland.
When Scotland would break with the UK, they join the EU again, that in itself can be done quite swiftly, but then what?
The EU's single market is far away. Only Norway is close and Ireland, but both only directly accessible over water.

Actually this cannot be done swiftly, because it is to be expected that other countries where secessionist movements are existant as well would vote against it to keep these internal movements down, e.g. like Spain.

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

Fuck the Scottish National Socialist Party and its ludicrous separatist agenda with a deep fried haggis. Why some people think that Brexit was bad but Joxit would be good I have no idea. Some stupid romantic Willy Wallace "freedumb!" call or what? Many of us in the UK voted remain but we are obliged to leave. Many people in Scotland voted to remain in the UK and remain in the EU. Why should each of them be obliged to suffer leaving both?

Because they do feel betrayed by Westminster? Just a thought... I mean, Scotland only joined the union in 1703, before it's been an independent kingdom for centuries.

And actually most of the administrative/political infrastructure to become independent is already in place. The big question is if the Scots still to feel in the future that their interests are being heared in London, or not. If not then probably they will sail away.

Actually a good English friend of mine from Nottingham is of the opinion that the UK is today much more loosely knit together than many people do realize; he's always telling if somebody puts a knife into it and turns it around it will break apart. Well, his opinion. The UK leaving EU is for him that turned around knife.

One big structural political problem the UK has is the dominance of England in terms of population and GDP, and also that many stuff is centralized in London. Maybe not to the extent like it is in France, but still very much centralized and skewed. And the regional parliaments/national assemblies are still quite young, founded in 1998/99.

 

[Innula Zenovka]