Is Douchelini in Jail Yet??

[Veritable Quandry]

I really don't understand what people in the US are and aren't allowed to say about criminal cases after someone's been charged. Our sub judice rules are clearly far tighter than are yours, but presumably US judges have considerable discretion if they think the defendant is trying to intimidate or otherwise influence potential witnesses.

Would it be possible for the judge to direct that Trump make no public comments on the case save through his lawyers, whom the judge will hold responsible, as officers of the court, for ensuring that any such comments are within the limits of whatever is acceptable under US law?

He wouldn't stick to it, of course, but I'm trying to think of the least restrictive set of conditions that would protect witnesses and prevent his trying to interfere with the course of public justice.

The court will start with the least restrictive measures (such as the verbal warning at his arraignment) and respond with increasing sanctions. They specifically avoid prior restraint of speech.

 

[WolfEyes]

Judge could start with contempt of court since Trump was ordered by the court and then immediately ignored that order.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contempt_of_court#United_States

In United States jurisprudence, acts of contempt are generally divided into direct or indirect, and civil or criminal. Direct contempt occurs in the presence of a judge; civil contempt is "coercive and remedial" as opposed to punitive. In the United States, relevant statutes include 18 U.S.C. §§ 401–403 and Federal Rule of Criminal Procedure 42.[18]

1. Direct contempt is that which occurs in the presence of the presiding judge (in facie curiae) and may be dealt with summarily: the judge notifies the offending party that he or she has acted in a manner which disrupts the tribunal and prejudices the administration of justice. After giving the person the opportunity to respond, the judge may impose the sanction immediately.
2. Indirect contempt occurs outside the immediate presence of the court and consists of disobedience of a court's prior order. Generally a party will be accused of indirect contempt by the party for whose benefit the order was entered. A person cited for indirect contempt is entitled to notice of the charge and an opportunity for hearing of the evidence of contempt and, since there is no written procedure, may or may not be allowed to present evidence in rebuttal.

 

[Veritable Quandry]

The military prison at Fort Leavenworth is well known to museums and historic reenactors. Part of the rehabilitation program includes teaching prisoners historic woodwork including wagon making. A great many historic cannon have had carriages built there for display or field use.

 

[detrius]

By this point, there are no "good" Trump supporters. It doesn't even matter if they held their nose when they voted for him. Supporting his positions while disliking the man himself just means they would prefer a cleaned up, polished version of Trump that doesn't flout their tender social sensibilities.

"If 10 people are sitting at a table being civil to 1 nazi sitting at the table, then there are 11 nazis at the table."

 

[detrius]

If, as is certainly possible, Trump is incapable of abiding by his bail conditions and, in consequence, finds his bail revoked, where would he be accommodated during his pre-trial detention?

As a former president, he's clearly a very high-risk prisoner, and is entitled to life-long protection by the Secret Service, who would presumably have to monitor and protect him during his incarceration.

At the very least I'd think they'd need to clear out a whole floor, and possibly a whole wing, for him. Or could they hold him on a military base somewhere, or a FBI secure facility, before and during his trial?

Gitmo

 

[Innula Zenovka]

Gitmo

It's a nice idea, but I think the point behind Guantanomo Bay is that it's outside the jurisdiction of the federal courts, in order to deny inmates the protection of habeas corpus, prohibitions against torture, and other constitutional rights the federal courts would enforce.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

The court will start with the least restrictive measures (such as the verbal warning at his arraignment) and respond with increasing sanctions. They specifically avoid prior restraint of speech.

It amounts to the same thing, I guess -- "if you issue any more threats against witnesses, direct or indirect, I'll cancel your bail."

 

[Veritable Quandry]

It is possible to issue a more explicit warning, restrict his movements, or issue a fine. But I don't think the judge will waste any time.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

It is possible to issue a more explicit warm ng, restrict his movements, or issue a fine. But I don't think the judge will waste any time.

Perhaps the next step would be to issue a stern warning, backed up by revoking his grant of bail in his own recognisance and replacing it with a substantial cash bail, while he'll forfeit along with his liberty if he further breaches his bail conditions by attempting to threaten witnesses or otherwise hinder the investigation.

 

[Cindy Claveau]

The military prison at Fort Leavenworth is well known to museums and historic reenactors.

And to Timothy McVeigh.

 

[Cindy Claveau]

'Safety risk' Trump should be put in 'solitary confinement'

I offered this solution the other day: Put him in solitary confinement," she said. "And then, he won't have exposure to the general population and then he won't be a safety risk, a security risk."

While prisons in the United States do place some inmates in solitary confinement, many human rights organizations have decried the practice as torture.

To which I'd say "Putting up with his disgusting tiny mouth for 6 or 8 years is also torture."

Additionally, keeping Trump in solitary confinement for potentially decades may not be feasible, as defense lawyer Danny Cevallos told the show that Trump is in for a lengthy jail stint if convicted.

"Just the base offense level has him at 15 to 21 months, that would be the recommended sentence," he said. "But once you start the add-ons in the guidelines — for example, did he substantially obstruct the proceedings?... Probably a judge would conclude, if he's convicted, that he did. Then, the numbers start going up dramatically. Yo get up to 70 months, 87 months."

 

[Beebo Brink]

From Jess Tiedrich:
holy shit, Donald Trump's reckless mouth is going to land him in custody. pass the popcorn
Donald Trump has the right to remain silent. too bad he doesn’t have the ability.

ETA: correct link

 

[Innula Zenovka]

From Jess Tiedrich:
holy shit, Donald Trump's reckless mouth is going to land him in custody. pass the popcorn
Donald Trump has the right to remain silent. too bad he doesn’t have the ability.

I think this is the link you meant, Beebo -- yours takes me to a WaPo story about the heatwaver in Phoenix.

holy shit, Donald Trump's reckless mouth is going to land him in custody. pass the popcorn

Donald Trump has the right to remain silent. too bad he doesn’t have the ability.

www.jefftiedrich.com

 

[Beebo Brink]

I think this is the link you meant, Beebo....

Thank you, Innula. (Gotta stop trying to post from my tablet.)

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

Jeff put this counterpoint in his own comments:

"If you go after me..."

Today, Donald Trump issued what can only be construed as a shot across the bow, after the Magistrate Judge Moxila Upadhyaya admonished him during arraignment yesterday that he must not commit any new crimes while on a pre-trial bond—the thing that’s keeping him out of jail before trial—and that...

joycevance.substack.com

 

[Cindy Claveau]

Jeff put this counterpoint in his own comments:

"If you go after me..."

Today, Donald Trump issued what can only be construed as a shot across the bow, after the Magistrate Judge Moxila Upadhyaya admonished him during arraignment yesterday that he must not commit any new crimes while on a pre-trial bond—the thing that’s keeping him out of jail before trial—and that...

joycevance.substack.com

Joyce is so good!

 

[detrius]

It's a nice idea, but I think the point behind Guantanomo Bay is that it's outside the jurisdiction of the federal courts, in order to deny inmates the protection of habeas corpus, prohibitions against torture, and other constitutional rights the federal courts would enforce.

I really no longer care about the correct application of procedure when it comes to Trump.

As far as I'm concerned, America can put him on a stick and wave this sack of pus and bile around to ward off hurricanes, like a bloated orange scarecrow.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

The walls at Mar-A-Lago must be covered with ketchup by now!

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

“I didn’t actually do what I am doing right now.” Is peak abuser logic.

 

[Isabeau]

I, too, am a witch, heh.

The guy‘s obsessed with witches and witch hunts…