The Israeli Goverment Has Become The Monster

Ellie

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This fucking ghoul literally refuses to answer the question “ is a Jewish life worth the same as a Palestinian life”. She dodges it multiple times and plays dumb as to why she’s even being asked it.

Maya Angelou, "When people show you who they are, believe them the first time."
 
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Cristiano

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She won back in October. Not exactly new news. Also, what's with the 27 second video of a photograph?
It was news to me I’m sorry I didn’t get your approval on the timeframe for what constitute news.
 

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It was news to me I’m sorry I didn’t get your approval on the timeframe for what constitute news.
Nothing on the video photo?
 

Ellie

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Not content with butchering their 'enemies' in the middle east, the monstrous Israeli govt. has long sought to discredit and eliminate any who dare oppose them in the US and other countries.

Targeting NYC mayor Mamdani because he's a Muslim is a given for these ghouls, and many others who also want him gone because he's shown effective change benefitting NYC residents is possible by doing it, while cutting out moneyed interest influences and graft helping keep the populace poor, miserable, and without any hope conitions could improve.


ISRAEL CAUGHT TARGETING NYC MAYOR MAMDANI! 🚨
 

Ellie

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Like Bibi's ridiculous Iranian nuke claim, I suspect this recent blunder, red meat tossed to raving racists, bigots, Islamaphobes, and other fellow monsters, will only make him and, sadly, Jewish populations of other countries who want nothing to do with him, far more unpopular.

"Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s historical warnings regarding Iran’s nuclear timeline—most famously his 2012 UN General Assembly cartoon bomb diagram—were notably contradicted by leaked secret Mossad cables showing intelligence assessments that Iran was not actively weaponizing"
 

Innula Zenovka

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Like Bibi's ridiculous Iranian nuke claim, I suspect this recent blunder, red meat tossed to raving racists, bigots, Islamaphobes, and other fellow monsters, will only make him and, sadly, Jewish populations of other countries who want nothing to do with him, far more unpopular.
He's probably simply been listening to J D Vance, who said much the same thing two years ago after Labour won the the general election

JD Vance: Donald Trump's vice president pick suggests UK is 'first Islamist country with nuclear weapons'

At least Vance knows we're not a Republic, which I guess is something.

In point of fact, there is, and has been for some time, an Islamic Republic with nukes -- The Islamic Republic of Pakistan.

The idea that Britain is, or is becoming, an Islamic country is, I understand, a common view Elon Musk's X, where it's promoted by fans of the "Great Replacement" theory who think that Sadiq Khan's London is an unlivable hell-hole.

I don't know how it's going to work out with Mamdani, but Sadiq Khan has developed a very good relationship with London's Jewish communities, because he's reassured them by word and actions since when first he was elected that, as a Muslim, he's personally very aware of the fears and concerns of members of London's various highly visible religious and cultural minorities.
 
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Ellie

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“It’s no secret, I disagree with the prime minister,” Ben Gvir said of Israel’s reduced operations in Gaza amid an international push to move ahead with US President Donald Trump’s peace plan. “”I think we should carry out targeted assassinations in Gaza, taking down 30 to 40 every night,” he said. Not just those who pose an immediate threat. No, there are people there who are not worthy of life. They shouldn’t live. They’re not even people.”
https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/ben-gvir-calls-for-killing-30-40-people-in-gaza-daily-in-comments-widely-shared-in-arab-media/
 

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Damn idiot news lady. You have to do a ton of mental gymnastics with a VERY specific definition genocide to think it's not genocide at this point. Like... "NO! You have to build a camp and name it "Auschwitz" or it's not real genocide! Israel names their death camps and prisons different things!"
 

Innula Zenovka

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Damn idiot news lady. You have to do a ton of mental gymnastics with a VERY specific definition genocide to think it's not genocide at this point. Like... "NO! You have to build a camp and name it "Auschwitz" or it's not real genocide! Israel names their death camps and prisons different things!"
There's a serious and respectable legal argument that the crime of genocide is being committed in Gaza. However, genocide is a specific crime in international law which requires proof of intent at an unusually demanding level. The ICJ has not yet determined that Israel has committed it.

Meanwhile, there's already a compelling body of evidence that Israel has committed, and is committing, a number of other war crimes and crimes against humanity, some of which have already resulted in the ICC issuing arrest warrants. Insisting that those allegations are somehow inadequate unless one can attach the word "genocide" risks confusing moral condemnation with legal classification.
 
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GoblinCampFollower

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There's a serious and respectable legal argument that the crime of genocide is being committed in Gaza. However, genocide is a specific crime in international law which requires proof of intent at an unusually demanding level. The ICJ has not yet determined that Israel has committed it.

Meanwhile, there's already a compelling body of evidence that Israel has committed, and is committing, a number of other war crimes and crimes against humanity, some of which have already resulted in the ICC issuing arrest warrants. Insisting that those allegations are somehow inadequate unless one can attach the word "genocide" risks confusing moral condemnation with legal classification.
I understand what you're saying, but really don't think that ultra particular definition of "genocide" is meaningful. Israel is committing the mass murder of non combatants and is proudly celebrating their intention to do it. I frankly think that if they could, they'd try to define "genocide" in a way that only covers genocide against their people. I think the only way you can claim Israel is NOT committing genocide is to come up with a very hair splitting, and ultimately meaningless definition.
 
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Innula Zenovka

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I understand what you're saying, but really don't think that ultra particular definition of "genocide" is meaningful. Israel is committing the mass murder of non combatants and is proudly celebrating their intention to do it. I frankly think that if they could, they'd try to define "genocide" in a way that only covers genocide against their people. I think the only way you can claim Israel is NOT committing genocide is to come up with a very hair splitting, and ultimately meaningless definition.
Genocide is a specific crime in international law. The mass murder of non-combatants is a different crime, as are destroying civilian infrastructure, collective punishment, withholding food and medical supplies, etc. Those crimes may also form part of the crime of genocide, but genocide remains a specific offence with specific points to prove.

I don't think it's helpful to use it simply to mean "a really bad crime against humanity," not least because that simply distracts attention from the other, very specific, crimes for which the ICC has already issued arrest warrants.

I really wanted the guy in the clip to stop arguing with the woman about genocide, because that's so difficult to prove because of the element of specific intent, and, instead, ask her about the ICC warrants and the specific crimes for which there's plenty of evidence Israel has committed.
 

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I understand what you're saying, but really don't think that ultra particular definition of "genocide" is meaningful. Israel is committing the mass murder of non combatants and is proudly celebrating their intention to do it. I frankly think that if they could, they'd try to define "genocide" in a way that only covers genocide against their people. I think the only way you can claim Israel is NOT committing genocide is to come up with a very hair splitting, and ultimately meaningless definition.
Exactly. At a certain point, those defending Israel by playing semantic games just make it look even worse. Whatever you call it, it is a fucking crime against humanity that the world can see and trying to weasel out of it by claiming it is not "x" is pathetic. The veil is fully off on all of the gaslighting.
 

Innula Zenovka

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Exactly. At a certain point, those defending Israel by playing semantic games just make it look even worse. Whatever you call it, it is a fucking crime against humanity that the world can see and trying to weasel out of it by claiming it is not "x" is pathetic. The veil is fully off on all of the gaslighting.
And I cannot understand why people want to distract attention from the numerous crimes against humanity that Israel clearly is committing and for which indictments have been issued by focusing on a crime Israel may have committed but which is considerably more difficult to prove and for which no indictments have been issued.

The only people who can say whether a genocide has taken place, in Israel or elsewhere, are the International Court of Justice (who are hearing the case but are unlikely to reach a verdict before 2028) and the International Criminal Court, who are yet to issue any indictments.

Meanwhile, the ICC has issued indictments against Netanyahu and Gallant for various war crimes and crimes against humanity, with the result that the US is trying to sanction and undermine the ICC.

To my mind arguing about genocide simply affords supporters of the Israeli government the opportunity to focus on allegations that are far more difficult to prove -- because "genocide" is a legal term with a far more specific meaning than "particularly outrageous war crimes and crimes against humanity" -- when the focus should be on the extremely grave crimes for which indictments exist and which are considerably easier to prove.

ETA -- Please, take a look at


with particular reference to the section "elements of the crime".

The popular understanding of what constitutes genocide tends to be broader than the content of the norm under international law.
 
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GoblinCampFollower

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The only people who can say whether a genocide has taken place, in Israel or elsewhere, are the International Court of Justice (who are hearing the case but are unlikely to reach a verdict before 2028) and the International Criminal Court, who are yet to issue any indictments.
I think the core of our disagreement is just that you are looking at this from the perspective of the law, which is arguably owned by the court. Meanwhile, many of us look at this as a moral thing, which isn't actually owned by any particular entity.

I understand your perspective, but maybe am less willing to agree that the ICC or other such entities have full ownership of the term. In any case, I can see the argument for saying that the slaughter is just a different set of still very grisly crimes that arguably are just as bad.