Coronavirus Updates

Casey Pelous

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Yeast are evolved to eat pretty much any plant sugars or starches (which are chains of sugars). They are most everywhere in the environment, and only need some water to go from inactive spore to live yeast. The first fermented products were natural ones, where a grain or a fruit got wet and then sat around for a while. Then we learned how to do it on purpose and got bread and beer. Any place that ground grains regularly would inevitably bring in some yeast spores, who would make a home there.

With modern grain processing into flour and cleaner kitchens we cut down a lot of the naturally occurring spores. A sourdough starter can take the natural spores from the air, but it takes longer to be ready, because it starts with fewer spores. Adding yeast from a jar or packet works much faster because you are adding so many more of them.
Some of us are doing natural starters because there's no yeast to be had out here in the hinterlands. Mine's a "no rush" deal -- I do the keto thing, so bread's not on my list unless .... dunt dunt dunnnnn .... supply chains break down.
 

Kara Spengler

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The obvious reason for which is he owns a bunch of hotels and resorts which are shut down at the moment, so he's rapidly going broke. Pure conflict of interest. Kill more Americans to save his business.
You mean his kids are not totally in control and he is a disinterested party? :)
 

Sovereignty

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Despite this being a..."hot take" and all, it's a comparison of same to same. All he's really looking at is the trend. And when you're comparing apples to apples for that, fatalities are not a bad fruit to be looking at.

You want an in-depth examination of the various statistical indicators? Stay away from Twitter posts.
Not doing per capita deaths is misleading.

If you want misleading graphs, go to twitter.
 
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Pamela

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Kemp and his ilk can open up whatever they like, but the vast majority of people — over 70% — say thanks, but no fucking way.

I do not understand the political strategy of encouraging your base To infect themselves with a deadly virus.
 

Clara D.

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Report: States Are Smuggling PPE In Order To Prevent The Feds From Seizing It
https://mavenroundtable.io/theintellectualist/news/report-states-are-smuggling-ppe-in-order-to-prevent-the-feds-from-seizing-it-IKkM6zhksUmBRRVc9v-6eg

Now, states and hospital officials are concealing shipments of supplies from the federal government in order to avoid detection. Illinois Gov. J.B. Pritzker, a Democrat, recently secretly bought millions of masks and gloves from China. He kept the details under wraps, "because we've heard reports of Trump trying to take PPE in China and when it gets to the United States," a source familiar with the situation told the Chicago Sun-Times.
 

Bartholomew Gallacher

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I agree, however in reality, it isn't going to happen.
It depends on the will of the CCP. I mean they put one million Uigurs in camps and million of people in quarantine. PRC is Orwell's 1984 nightmare squared.

If they want to shut it down I am sure they've got enough power to do so. They don't want to shut it down because it might damage their power base, that's the truth about it.
 

bubblesort

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Luc Montagnier, the virologist who discovered the HIV virus and earned a nobel prize for it, has an idea different from the main stream on how the new coronavirus strain came into being.

Montagnier sequenced the RNA of the virus and claims to have founds parts of the HIV genome in it. He is sure about that such a sharing of genomes between viruses in bodies is not possible, so let's say a corona virus infected a human who suffered from AIDS and therefore got parts of this genome into its own. Since he is so sure about that this happened not naturally he comes to the conclusion that this virus strain must be the result of scientific research on an anti AIDS vaccine.

Since a high security virus laboratory is located in Wuhan he thinks it is quite possible that a security breach happened, and this virus strain came into nature that way we are all suffering now.

It is well known that in 2011 US and Chinese researchers visited a big bat population in South China in order to collect excrement and spit samples, in which they found until then 27 unknown virus types. They already found a SARS similar virus which uses its spike to attach at the ACE2 receptors of the human mouth and published these results 2013 in Nature Medicine (Isolation and characterization of a bat SARS-like coronavirus that uses the ACE2 receptor).

Then they made research with these samples, and the strains were used to infect bat, mice, human cells to observe how this stuff is changing if changing its host. The result of this research was published 2015 in an article named "A SARS-like cluster of circulating bat coronaviruses shows potential for human emergence" (A SARS-like cluster of circulating bat coronaviruses shows potential for human emergence). This was the end of the joint research between the USA and PRC.

This article documents that indeed those viruses have been artificially genetically altered. A view days after it was released a big debate was going on, this is what Nature Medicine had to tell the world about it (Engineered bat virus stirs debate over risky research):

An experiment that created a hybrid version of a bat coronavirus — one related to the virus that causes SARS (severe acute respiratory syndrome) — has triggered renewed debate over whether engineering lab variants of viruses with possible pandemic potential is worth the risks.

In an article published in Nature Medicine1 on 9 November, scientists investigated a virus called SHC014, which is found in horseshoe bats in China. The researchers created a chimaeric virus, made up of a surface protein of SHC014 and the backbone of a SARS virus that had been adapted to grow in mice and to mimic human disease. The chimaera infected human airway cells — proving that the surface protein of SHC014 has the necessary structure to bind to a key receptor on the cells and to infect them. It also caused disease in mice, but did not kill them.

Although almost all coronaviruses isolated from bats have not been able to bind to the key human receptor, SHC014 is not the first that can do so. In 2013, researchers reported this ability for the first time in a different coronavirus isolated from the same bat population

The findings reinforce suspicions that bat coronaviruses capable of directly infecting humans (rather than first needing to evolve in an intermediate animal host) may be more common than previously thought, the researchers say.

But other virologists question whether the information gleaned from the experiment justifies the potential risk. Although the extent of any risk is difficult to assess, Simon Wain-Hobson, a virologist at the Pasteur Institute in Paris, points out that the researchers have created a novel virus that “grows remarkably well” in human cells. “If the virus escaped, nobody could predict the trajectory,” he says.


Anyway, Nature Medicine has a big fat warning above the article that in their opinion there's no evidence that the coronavirus COVID19 was genetically engineered.

Also in 2008 Chinese scientists were successfully working on genetically modifying a bat coronavirus in such a way that it can bind itself on ACE2 receptors, which was published in this paper: Difference in Receptor Usage between Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome (SARS) Coronavirus and SARS-Like Coronavirus of Bat Origin

This study indeed worked with HIV genome in order to genetically modify the virus; it was not direclty injected into the genome, but could have happened due to unwanted exchanges.

There has also been an Indian study which came to similar conclusions that the new type of coronavirus is the result of bioengineering, but was withdrawn by its authors. Official explanation: statistical errors.

Anyway, the reputation of Montagnier at the moment is not the best compared to former times because he supports homeopathy, and his opinion is not well received at all. What is fact though is that in Wuhan the high security laboratory worked in a joint effort research program with the USA on corona viruses from bats, and genetically modified them - and that's it.

For example the claim "the new strain of corona virus contains HIV parts" by Montagnier is being disputed here, but also look into the comments for valuable context as well: No, SARS-CoV-2 does not contain HIV genetic code!
I don't know if I'd jump to the engineering conclusion without a much more in depth investigation. I'm not saying it's impossible, and that should be investigated, but there are other explanations that maybe should be investigated, as well. For example, another explanation might be that COVID19 was infected by another naturally occurring virus that made it similar to HIV. I was just reading Crisis in the Hot Zone a few weeks ago, and in it, Richard Preston mentioned a water cooling tower in france, where a massive virus named Leviathan lived in great quantities (it's massive on tiny viral scales, at least). It survived by infecting and multiplying amoeba in the water tower. A smaller virus called Sputnik infected Leviathan, and made it unable to reproduce. Viruses that infect other viruses are called satellite viruses. I have to wonder if it's possible that a satellite virus might infect another virus and give it some HIV similarities, somehow? IDK, I don't have any training in biology at all.
 
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Bartholomew Gallacher

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Kemp and his ilk can open up whatever they like, but the vast majority of people — over 70% — say thanks, but no fucking way.

I do not understand the political strategy of encouraging your base To infect themselves with a deadly virus.
It is pretty reckless. I doubt the person on my team who works from GA plans on changing things.
 

Kara Spengler

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I don't know if I'd jump to the engineering conclusion without a much more in depth investigation. I'm not saying it's impossible, and that should be investigated, but there are other explanations that maybe should be investigated, as well. For example, another explanation might be that COVID19 was infected by another naturally occurring virus that made it similar to HIV. I was just reading Crisis in the Hot Zone a few weeks ago, and in it, Richard Preston mentioned a water cooling tower in france, where a massive virus named Leviathan lived in great quantities (it's massive on tiny viral scales, at least). It survived by infecting and multiplying amoeba in the water tower. A smaller virus called Sputnik infected Leviathan, and made it unable to reproduce. Viruses that infect other viruses are called satellite viruses. I have to wonder if it's possible that a satellite virus might infect another virus and give it some HIV similarities, somehow? IDK, I don't have any training in biology at all.
No matter what was the cause it does not change what needs to happen right now. China covering it up then blaming in on nature certainly sounds suspicious. After everything though, I expect there will be a full investigation and if it was the result of artificial events the responsible entity will face full criminal repercussions and be responsible for ALL liabilities. Yes, even if it results in an entire major country not existing, I doubt the world would accept anything less.
 

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SARS was already a sensitive topic. Covering up an outbreak to reduce domestic unrest makes absolute sense.
 
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Fionalein

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SARS was already a sensitive topic. Covering up an outbreak to reduce domestic unrest makes absolute sense.
If the communist government cannot controll the outbreak they must have lost their mandate from heaven... I think despite cultural revolution this thought is still deeply embedded in Chinese culture - and we all know what happens when a Chinese dynasty looses that mandate...
 
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danielravennest

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Kemp and his ilk can open up whatever they like, but the vast majority of people — over 70% — say thanks, but no fucking way.

I do not understand the political strategy of encouraging your base To infect themselves with a deadly virus.
My governor (Kemp) may not be the total idiot I assumed. Announcing the state is opening up blunts the protests from the pro-virus death cultists. It also reduces the pressure from larger businesses if we appear to be on a path to normalcy.

At the same time, the list of allowed businesses is all "high contact": gyms, fitness centers, bowling alleys, body art studios, barbers, cosmetologists, hair designers, nail care artists, estheticians, and massage therapists. So a lot of the business owners, staff, and customers can't possibly maintain the required 6 ft spacing, and will decide to stay closed, or not patronize the places.

"Essential businesses" like supermarkets and pharmacies never were closed. None of the ones allowed to open fit that category. Anyone who cares about their health can stay away.

I have no evidence this is actually his plan. He could still be as stupid as I thought he was. We'll see what happens in the next few days.
 
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Pamela

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My governor (Kemp) may not be the total idiot I assumed. Announcing the state is opening up blunts the protests from the pro-virus death cultists. It also reduces the pressure from larger businesses if we appear to be on a path to normalcy.

At the same time, the list of allowed businesses is all "high contact": gyms, fitness centers, bowling alleys, body art studios, barbers, cosmetologists, hair designers, nail care artists, estheticians, and massage therapists. So a lot of the business owners, staff, and customers can't possibly maintain the required 6 ft spacing, and will decide to stay closed, or not patronize the places.

"Essential businesses" like supermarkets and pharmacies never were closed. None of the ones allowed to open fit that category. Anyone who cares about their health can stay away.

I have no evidence this is actually his plan. He could still be as stupid as I thought he was. We'll see what happens in the next few days.
I just skimmed over some possible convoluted plan that would at some point relieve the state from paying unemployment insurance for people who are invited back to work and decline because they prefer not to risk death.

Impossible to overestimate the evilness of these sub humans.
 

Caliandris

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I don't think it's stupidity at all.

Rather, the scientists are providing them with evidence upon which to take political decisions -- "if you do this, then the likely result is A, while if you do something else, then the likely result is B, and here's the evidence to support these two statements" -- and the politicians then decide, or not, what to do.

The politicians, meanwhile, are using the advice to shift responsibility for the consequences of their decisions onto the scientists, to try to avoid criticism.

In the US, Trump has clearly told his scientific advisors to come up with a strategy for lifting restrictions and restarting the economy as quickly as possible.

This they have done, but it would be wrong to say that his political decision to give priority to restarting the economy rather than preserving lives was based on scientific advice -- rather, then scientists offered him several possible different options, along with an explanation of their practical implications, and he decided which one he wanted to pursue.

Scientists are responsible for the advice they offer, but politicians are responsible for deciding what to do about the advice they receive, even though it sometimes suits them to pretend otherwise.
Nobody needs to watch anything they don't want to. But I have found the vlogs from Chris Martenson (which someone on VVO recommended to me) to be measured and thorough. I have checked out the things he says and found them to be true. The most recent looks at the way in which there is a bit of a knee-jerk reaction going on in the way scientists and medics are reacting to things at present. In the UK government will make pronouncements claiming to be following the science and then be inundated with articles from actual virologists or epidemiologists saying that they're not following any science they recognize. As they keep the formation of the SAGE committee which apparently advises the government on science secret (although the Guardian has an expose on it this weekend) it's hard to know if they are or not.

In terms of mask wearing, the Peak Prosperity guy has been for them from the beginning on the grounds that the countries which are doing well are wearing masks and the ones which are doing less well have either been slow to introduce them or have only introduced in some settings like healthcare. The results from the Czech republic, where they have a high level of infection but a very low level of death, do seem to indicate that if mask wearing doesn't protect from infection, it does protect from having a high viral load on infection which leads to worse outcomes.

The reason I follow Chris Martenson is because he transferred his attention and effort from the investment channel he was running some time ago away from investments and towards information about the coronoavirus and he has been very thorough in pulling apart the things which are said in the media, and trying to find real information to back them up. I have found his information on the research that has come out recently very useful and interesting. But each to his or her or their own, and we all probably choose the information sources which best suit us.

I'm planting a garden though. I think he's right that food instability is coming, and the best time to plant a garden is either a year ago, or today.
 
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