The 'other' Second Life

Val

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I used SL for 11 years, using Voice chat almost entirely (with the rest being group chat, IM chat, or IM voice)

In my 11 years of SL, I’ve probably spent an accumulated time of less than 10 hours actually reading local chat texts.

Easily over 99% of all my SL interaction has been via local voice channel.

I can’t emphasize enough how strong and important the friendships I’ve made are. I currently live with the person who was my SL partner. I have friends around the globe who now have discord and and we keep in touch that way.

The few people who were text only in SL? Well.. they are still in SL. And I’m not.

I’ve never felt any sort of strong connection to someone only talk to via text. It feels so emotionless.

That said, I use voice chat in private groups. Never in public. The public of SL is terrible, nothing specific to voice chat. Those people are just as terrible to talk to via text.
You made me greatly curious as to how many people use voice locally and I really want to hop around the grid and see. It is very true that not many goes on in text on any kind of sim unless it is a RP. Voice does not work for me at the moment but I know why - some port issues so might fix it. Not that I would hear much as crap ears but my curiosity was piqued.

But Infohubs and Welcome areas seem to have just advanced to voice from usual text chats. I guess to make it a bit better - most parties arguing are there to do so.
 

Adeon Writer

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You made me greatly curious as to how many people use voice locally and I really want to hop around the grid and see. It is very true that not many goes on in text on any kind of sim unless it is a RP. Voice does not work for me at the moment but I know why - some port issues so might fix it. Not that I would hear much as crap ears but my curiosity was piqued.

But Infohubs and Welcome areas seem to have just advanced to voice from usual text chats. I guess to make it a bit better - most parties arguing are there to do so.
I feel like you may be too late late. Once Discord came around, the good aspects of voice chat - private communities, with strong, real connections between people, moved to discord. This meant they no longer needed to be in the same sim - or the same game - but also grandfathered these communities preventing new ones from forming. Second Life has slowly been returning to a text-only platform.

Which is a shame, I joined SL just as voice chat was added, and it’s all it is to me. I was never interested in reading text messages. I’ve moved on too.
 

Argent Stonecutter

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I can’t emphasize enough how strong and important the friendships I’ve made are. I currently live with the person who was my SL partner. I have friends around the globe who now have discord and and we keep in touch that way.

The few people who were text only in SL? Well.. they are still in SL. And I’m not.
I met my wife in a text-only role playing game. Played on an Apple-][ BBS. In like 1983. I got my last job from a guy I'd only known in email and Usenet posts. Whether you can establish a personal relationship with a pen-pal or not isn't due to them just being someone you communicate with in text.
 

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I met my wife in a text-only role playing game. Played on an Apple-][ BBS. In like 1983. I got my last job from a guy I'd only known in email and Usenet posts. Whether you can establish a personal relationship with a pen-pal or not isn't due to them just being someone you communicate with in text.
You aren’t wrong, but everyone is different. And, if I can be a bit bold? Your case isn’t common. Maybe it’s an generational thing but no one I know has huge friendships over exclusively text. It’s too impersonal/cold. Rude, even. Plus if you ever do switch to voice you learn it was never actually what you thought it was. Voice is real. There is no room for misinterpretation. Thousands of years of evolution make sure you feel real connections, too.

Talk to me via text or via voice and you might as well be taking to two entriely different personalities and it’s nothing I’m doing on purpose. And this isn’t just true for me, it’s true for everyone who I know well.
 
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Clara D.

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/me does just fine with "real connections" via text (SL GF of 6+ years along with several other friends I've had since I was an '06 noob and eventually met in RL) and don't find it at all "rude and impersonal," although part of that is that SL supplements the text with visuals. Some of us grew up with text being the *only* way to communicate over the internet and are used to the nuances in that medium.

Voice in SL requires too much immediate directed attention and you can't scroll back to see what you've missed. Text I can get up to pee, make a sammich, see what the cat is yowling about, etc whenever and not miss major chunks of conversation. Besides a lot of my time in SL is for listening to music, so I don't really want a bunch of people yammering over the top of it. Some of my favorite moments are dancing with a GF and listening to music while we feel each other up in PM's.

Definitely a generational thing, now people don't even want straightforward "how-to's" in text&picture format and need YouTube "tutorials," which I personally hate. I'd rather have text I can just follow along at my own pace and easily backtrack steps supplemented with static pictures I don't have to pause and/or rewind back to.

As far as "missing out" by not voicing, you're missing out just as much by not wanting to text, but to each his/her/their own.
 
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Kalel

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i have no problem using SL voice but it seems those that do can't get over the fact that i'm a guy with a female avie. Voice breaks immersion and they can't handle it. like you said it's real and hard to disguise. i've used the morph tool once or twice but i'd rather not bother. 90% of the places i hang out in the past 12 years haven't really used it. i don't know anyone else that has used the morph tools either.

Voice chat was always around but it was usually a third party service and not built in.. as more programs/games started integrating it and the quality got better slowly picked up speed. voice was general locked behind a paywall... then Discord became alternative free solution with social media integrated and it blew out of control.

the rise of E sports, Digital Assistants, Video calls and always online media are pushing the younger generation to use Headsets and speak online... Most Pre millennial grew up with aol chatroom and first generation texting. so i do believe generation you grew up in also is a variable.
 

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Plus if you ever do switch to voice you learn it was never actually what you thought it was.
I have literally been "using voice" my whole life, and electronically mediated voice in any form (phone, voice conferences) is unconditionally worse than text. SL is no exception. I've tried it. It's no different than calling into a conference remotely.

I always prefer to text people or send them email rather than contact them via phone.

And that's not so uncommon that texting people and not using the "phone" part of a smartphone at all hasn't become a meme.

I have found High Fidelity, where you have a full VR environment where you hear the voice coming from the actual avatars around you, is a lot better, but even there I miss text chat when there's more than two or three active participants in the conversation.

i have no problem using SL voice but it seems those that do can't get over the fact that i'm a guy with a female avie. Voice breaks immersion and they can't handle it.
This is totally a problem in High Fidelity where voice is the only option. Even with its small user base I've run into at least two guys who have been harassed over this.
 
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Brenda Archer

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I have trouble following a conversation in voice if there are too many speakers, or if there is also music or background noise. Also, I’m often using SL at late hours when I don’t want people to hear me talking aloud. Or if I’m logging into SL from my laptop when I’m not at home, I can’t use voice.

Text is silent and private. Combined with headphones, it keeps SL from being heard by my nosy housemates.

To get into a Discord group I’d have to find one that meets in the day in my time zone, rather than the evening. So I’ve never tried it.
 

Sid

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All what Clara already said, plus:
If you are a non native English speaker, voice is not practical to use in an international community.
Typing gives one the possibility to reread things, sometimes even look things up.
And besides, ever tried to talk to someone from India, France, Louisiana or Texas? OnE can perfectly chat with them in text, but with their English accents in voice? Good luck with that.
 
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Ashiri

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All what Clara already said, plus:
If you are a non native English speaker, voice is not practical to use in an international community.
Typing gives one the possibility to reread things, sometimes even look things up.
And besides, ever tried to talk to someone from India, France, Louisiana or Texas? On can perfectly chat with them in text, but with their English accents in voice? Good luck with that.
Or even from parts of England.

Now I have used voice in SL and the reaction is usually "OMG, a aussie/kiwi" or "Cool accent". Also used to use Skype, but most of the time it was just text chat used to avoid talking over music or each other.
 

Val

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Let us not forget Scotland which has much more variety than England in accents and a person from Glasgow and Oban are going to stare at each other bewildered (had a flatmate from Oban and I myself moved to Glasgow just then. Also lived with: northern England and Dublin).

I do not think it is generational at all but down to how brain likes to process information. I know people who are much older than me and only like audiobooks (and they were born in times a mere literature library was uncommon) or those who abhor phones and are younger than me (... or just me). I also know totally opposite kinds of people. Usually it connects to if they fancy audio more or visuals and then to the type of it. I always been visual and crap at retaining information when spoken to so I formed connections better with people I written with.

I do not speak to anyone online bar family and I am most likely on Skype with husband anyway so my ears are busy (we still are in process of moving together and yep - also met on SL and in text based RP). I hate phones for anything else or talking to folks I do not know (if I hear them at all that is) and my job used to be phone based ;) same as my uni course which was media production and editing (did lots of radio and films and presentations ....). In school, I was the default designated narrator for anything .... life really is unfair.
 
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Adeon Writer

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I don’t think the phone example applies; I hate getting cellphone calls and would rather you text me becasue I’m doing other stuff and you’re phone call demands my immediate attention and texts let me multitask.

On a computer my fingers are busy and I would rather you call me on discord than text message me because typing and reading requires my attention but using my voice let’s me multitask.
 
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Argent Stonecutter

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I'm talking about real time conversation, like collaborating with a co-worker or scheduled meetings that I would physically be at were I at the office. I would still rather hold the discussion in IRC or Slack than voice. Because I can read WAY WAY faster than I can listen, and I don't have to wait until someone finishes typing before I can make a comment so I can *effectively* type faster than I can talk too.

As for "my fingers are busy" and "multitasking"... I've never had to say "sorry can you type that again I was concentrating on something else".

I can see voice for real-time reflex games but I don't play real-time reflex games any more. And when I did I didn't exactly like people talking at me when I was trying to concentrate.
 
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Luisa Land

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All what Clara already said, plus:
If you are a non native English speaker, voice is not practical to use in an international community.
Typing gives one the possibility to reread things, sometimes even look things up.
And besides, ever tried to talk to someone from India, France, Louisiana or Texas? OnE can perfectly chat with them in text, but with their English accents in voice? Good luck with that.
Lets not forget the dutch people....
 

Argent Stonecutter

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Dis is my fideo!
 

EmpressOfCommunism

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I must be weird, I do fine with either medium for friendships. I know deaf people who don't voice and we do fine, and I have a close friend with such severe dyslexia that voice is the only option for things that require him to look professional on here. When my partner is on line, very often it's me voicing in a call and him text chatting me back. It's easier for me to voice to him, and since English is not his first language its more comfortable for him to hear what I've said and take the time to type back.
 
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Wildefire Walcott

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Most of my friends from when I was socially active in-world (2005-2008) who still play exclusively use text chat still. Almost every one of them. Sometimes I get on with my kids and we go to voice-enabled places to fart around with the weirdos (you still see some really spectacular avatars in the welcome areas/infohubs), but I agree that the quality of conversation in voice chat SL is completely dismal compared to text chat SL. In my experience it's fun/funny to use voice chat, but only in small doses.
 

Val

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I connect phones and internet voice as same due to to me treating them as same and you both elaborating made me go "wait a second ... people actually disconnect those?" which never occurred to me but it makes sense. I would gladly write notes instead of speak at times in person so I guess I just have a voice bias.
 

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For me it’s not so much that I prefer voice it’s that I prefer the conversations that tend to happen on voice over the conversations that happen over text.

I hate RP. I hate it with a passion. I don’t care if other people do it I just don’t want to be included or involved in anyway. RP doesn’t really happen on voice. Voice in private communities are almost always meta. I like meta. I pretty much have exclusively talked meta for 12 years.

(Meta = talking about SL within SL: viewer development, scripting, texturing, modeling, technical support, bugs, new features, avatar modding; the kind of discussion that’s zero fun for an immersionist)
 
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CronoCloud Creeggan

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I used SL for 11 years, using Voice chat almost entirely (with the rest being group chat, IM chat, or IM voice)
In my 11 years of SL, I’ve probably spent an accumulated time of less than 10 hours actually reading local chat texts.
Easily over 99% of all my SL interaction has been via local voice channel.
Whut? Is this a Furry community thing? Adeon, you're making my head do the scanners exploding head thing. Really, 11 years in SL and only read text for 10 hours? SL is FULL of text. my combined chat.txt logs from my years of logging local are 122MB. That's 122MB of pure text. Then there's the IM's and group chats. Do you not use group chat? I've been in SL since July 19th of 2006. I almost never use voice, in fact, there wasn't any voice chat when I joined. And I can't imagine using voice at various social venues, too many people, it would be chaotic beyond belief. The communities I've been involved with in SL don't use voice. And in general, while I do leave voice enabled, I almost never use it. I have to have some serious trust in people to use it. Also one can't log voice and my logs have saved my bacon

I’ve never felt any sort of strong connection to someone only talk to via text. It feels so emotionless.
You're making my head explode again. Text is full of emotion. Right now, my text I am writing here is conveying my "Whut?" I've formed many an emotional attachment over text in SL, and in IRC before SL. To me, SL has always been "IRC, but with avatars, shopping and things to do with other avatars"

That said, I use voice chat in private groups.
How did your private groups handle large numbers of people?

I feel like you may be too late late. Once Discord came around, the good aspects of voice chat - private communities, with strong, real connections between people, moved to discord.
Discord is propietary IRC with voice added in, I don't understand the appeal of it when IRC and decent IRC clients already exist. To me, it's just a propietary re-invention of the wheel used by people who don't know IRC already existed.

This meant they no longer needed to be in the same sim - or the same game - but also grandfathered these communities preventing new ones from forming.
Which communities? Were they communities with a large out-of-SL presence anyway?

Which is a shame, I joined SL just as voice chat was added, and it’s all it is to me. I was never interested in reading text messages. I’ve moved on too.
Noob! ;-) But I'm wondering, how did you communicate with the masses of SL who didn't use voice? Or were your activities in SL confined to a specific voice using community?

Maybe it’s an generational thing
What generations are we referring to here? I'm 51.

but no one I know has huge friendships over exclusively text. It’s too impersonal/cold. Rude, even.
You're making my head explode again, Adeon. Text...impersonal? My goddess Adeon, LETTERS are a thing, e-mail is a thing, IRC is a thing, Facebook messaging in text is a thing. People have been making friendships over text for centuries. Hell, people romanced over telegraph even. And don't get me started on the people who made friends via Compuserve, the Source or Quantumlink.

Plus if you ever do switch to voice you learn it was never actually what you thought it was.
What do you mean by that?

Voice is real.
What do you mean by that?

There is no room for misinterpretation.
Whut? Homophones are a thing, why do you think the military alphabet exists? Don't tell me you've never had to implicitly spell out words over voice when they were misunderstood.

Talk to me via text or via voice and you might as well be taking to two entriely different personalities and it’s nothing I’m doing on purpose.
Whut? I'm sorry Adeon, but this makes no sense to me. I can hear my "internal voice" while writing.

And this isn’t just true for me, it’s true for everyone who I know well.
I have a question, and I hate asking this one, but I think it is necessary for context. Are those communities you're a part of/the people you know, heavy with the "Autistic-spectrum furry" demographic?

This is totally a problem in High Fidelity where voice is the only option. Even with its small user base I've run into at least two guys who have been harassed over this.
One reason I rarely use voice, except with people I trust. I'm premium, I could use voice morphs, but again I use voice so rarely to begin with.

I have trouble following a conversation in voice if there are too many speakers, or if there is also music or background noise.
Yep, voice is useless for large groups, unless it's more like a lecture where one person is designated to talk.

Also, I’m often using SL at late hours when I don’t want people to hear me talking aloud.Text is silent and private. Combined with headphones, it keeps SL from being heard by my nosy housemates.
Yep, my work schedule is such that even on my days off, I'm up when others are asleep. It's yet another reason I don't voice in SL.

On a computer my fingers are busy and I would rather you call me on discord than text message me because typing and reading requires my attention but using my voice let’s me multitask.
Question, what are your fingers busy doing? Coding? WASDing in some game?

Voice in private communities are almost always meta. I like meta. I pretty much have exclusively talked meta for 12 years.

(Meta = talking about SL within SL: viewer development, scripting, texturing, modeling, technical support, bugs, new features, avatar modding; the kind of discussion that’s zero fun for an immersionist)
How the hell can you talk about technical subjects in SL like tech support over voice. Homophones are an issue as well as having to implicitly spell some things. Suppose you've diagnosed a technical issue that requires a user to delete their settings.xml. It would be FAR easier to tell them how and where to do that via text than voice. Another example, I commented on a Slashdot post where someone was complaining about systemd logging and how it doesn't go to the traditional syslogs. I told them that systemd can and in most cases DOES forward to syslog so they could use their old-style methods, but that isn't the default on Fedora. I also told them how to change it, which requires an edit in /etc/systemd/journald.conf Explaining that in text was far easier than if I had tried to explain that in voice. I would have had to implicitly spell out the path and probably the edit too.

Not only that, but copy and paste is a thing. Notice that the Firestorm support channel is text. And if you go to various classes in SL about various things, they would be done in text.

Again, Adeon, your whole "I don't use text in SL" thing just makes my head explode because text is extremely important in SL. For goodness sake, SL has notecards and LSL commands designed to recieve/send/manipulate text! Maybe SL was never a good a fit as a platform for you in the first place.
 
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