Brexit.

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

Competent - who on earth should this be? Theresa May is a weak leader; all she did was trying to appease to her hardcore Brexiteers by all means do keep the Tories together, and she failed.

Corbyn? He's moody, and shows no real ambition to do anything aside thinking about this and that at the moment; he's not driving the government to do anything.

If May leaves, the chances are high that the self deluded elite like Johnson or Rees-Moog tries to become prime minister. And who knows, they might succeed, because the voice of sanity is so silent nowadays in Westminster.

In the end the truth is sad it would be really better if the parties finally break apart, so that the well being of the country does not depend longer on the well being of some parties.

 

[Casey Pelous]

So we're back to having the Dutch take over, then?

 

[OrinB]

Theresa May is a weak leader; all she did was trying to appease to her hardcore Brexiteers by all means do keep theIf May leaves, the chances are high that the self deluded elite like Johnson or Rees-Moog tries to become prime minister. And who knows, they might succeed, because the voice of sanity is so silent nowadays in Westminster.

The tories can't afford for May to leave. There isn't another throwaway candidate for leader that people will rally around. None of the more obvious candidates want to be the lader that fucked up the governemnt. Why do you think Boris excreted himself rather shittily from any leadership campaign since he left being Mayor of London?

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

Meanwhile in Italy:

 

[Innula Zenovka]

No long Brexit delay without election of British MEPs, says leaked paper

There's been quite some discussion among EU lawyers on Twitter about that opinion. Certainly if the UK asks for a long extension then the elections will have to be held (which I think the government accepts) but the consensus seems to be that if there's a short extension and then the need arises to extend that past the date of the elections there should be a way round the problem provided the political will exists in the EU to agree the extension.

There's a good thread and comments here

Certainly, though, I think a long extension makes sense, simply as a precaution, even if the goal is to pass the European Union (Withdrawal Agreement) Bill by the end of June. There's so much that could go wrong it would be very rash not to allow for that possibility.

 

[Porsupah Ree]

I'll assume most of us are in the mood to laugh at this situation, if it's a choice between that and despair, so..

Brexit – the niche production that truly brought the house down | Marina Hyde

We focus so much on what divides parliament’s warring Brexitfactions, when almost all of them are united by the guiding principle of brinkmanship: “Eventually someone will stop acting like a shit, but it certainly won’t be me.” The past few days have been like watching the Cuban missile crisis re-enacted by the Teletubbies.

To say the drama at Westminster came off as meth-assisted is to flatter it. Take Stephen Barclay, the unknown who was recently cast as Brexit secretary on the basis that he met the role’s single criterion: looking like you could snap a towel in a locker-room, then go, “Don’t be a girl, mate!” Stephen summed up the debate for the government. “It is time for this house to act in the national interest,” he said, presumably for the lulz. “It’s time to put forward an extension that is realistic.” And with that, he voted against that very extension. Abstentions included the actual chief whip, Julian Smith. Like a lot of Tory MPs this week, I haven’t paid much attention to Smith. But that is quite the character note.

The whole thing's quite a joy, as far as gallows humor goes. ^_^

 

[Chav Paderborn]

The tories can't afford for May to leave. There isn't another throwaway candidate for leader that people will rally around. None of the more obvious candidates want to be the lader that fucked up the governemnt. Why do you think Boris excreted himself rather shittily from any leadership campaign since he left being Mayor of London?

I think none of them want to be the one that presses the button on Brexit because they don't want to be remembered as "the PM who destroyed the UK for no good reason." BJ and the mouse-man want the top job, but they know it's poison right now.

 

[Sid]

So we're back to having the Dutch take over, then?

We could send Geert Wilders, he is pro a Nexit.
He could fit in, realising a Brexit.

And....... "finders keepers" of course.

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

German minister of foreign affairs, Heiko Maas, noted in an interview that an extension is a good thing compared to a no deal Brexit and that Germany does favor an extension. But he also mentioned, that the UK still cannot take this extension for granted, since many countries haven't made up their mind yet, and that it makes only sense if London finally tells what their plan is, their concrete objectives.

And here it is again, the major problem between the EU and UK at the moment.

 

[Tigger]

350 people sign up for Farage's "March to Leave" 100 turn up.

Nigel Farage will not complete Brexit Betrayal march despite urging supporters to join him


This is a 200 mile march. Except for the bits that will be done on buses. Farage will only do "some" of it. Which means popping up for photo ops.
Mean while "led by donkeys" has managed to find enough funds to send a billboard truck along which will play adverts highlighting Farage's lies the whole way.

Although several lengthy sections of the route will be missed out, with walkers bussed up to 30 miles from the end of one day's walk to the start of the next, they will still walk up to 20 miles a day, every day, for two weeks.

Now these are middle aged to elderly people who have apparently 'self certified' themselves as fit for this event.

Experienced ramblers have expressed doubts about such a gruelling schedule.

Bill McTimoney, chairman of Teesside's Stockton Rambling Club, says an inexperienced walker would not be able to complete it.

He warned: "You can't walk off the street and do the day walks we do."

He believes 200 miles in 14 days would be a big challenge even for an experienced long distance walker.

Given the demographic that's doing the walking I fear the numbers may be somewhat depleted by the time they arrive.

 

[Porsupah Ree]

The hilariously tragic thing underlying this current deadlock is that it could all be solved quite readily by a new referendum - but the Brexit Taliban can't abide the idea, knowing full well the original result was fraudulent (overspending and funny money), and that as Leave voters strongly lent toward being older, a new referendum will see some of them no longer with us, and conversely, plenty of 16 & 17 year olds then now being eligible to vote, not to mention some Leavers finally realising so much of what they were told - £350m for the NHS, lower immigration - were lies. Of course, there are Labour MPs similarly unwilling, having bought into the canard of "but my constituents voted for it!", as if that stops the likes of Steven Baker from not only defying his voters, but cheerleading the process.

From what I've read, the People's Vote brigade deliberately haven't moved yet, feeling they've only got one shot at this, and need - unfortunately - to wait until the last minute. Does anyone have insight into what they're hoping to bring about first? I'm guessing that'll be after the march next Saturday.

 

[Arkady Arkright]

There's a suggestion in the papers today that the EU may require a second referendum as part of any extension. Might just be a 'frightener' leak from a brexiteer, but would be great if it actually happened.

 

[Da5id Weatherwax]

Now these are middle aged to elderly people who have apparently 'self certified' themselves as fit for this event.

I'm in my 50s and if I were dumb enough to be a Brexiteer, let alone part of Farrage's wankfest, I'd "self-certify"... but then I walk between 5 and 10 miles or run 2 on 5 days of every week, rain snow or shine. The other two days I put in 2 hours of martial arts practice. 20 miles in a day would give me plenty of time for a leisurely lunch break and to relax at either end and get a good nights sleep, so I've no doubt I could keep it up for a couple of weeks. On the other hand, the folks who ARE dumb enough to be part of this probably don't overlap too much with the demographic that are as diligent in "taking care of the machine" as I am

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

MP Nick Boles left today the Tories.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

The hilariously tragic thing underlying this current deadlock is that it could all be solved quite readily by a new referendum - but the Brexit Taliban can't abide the idea, knowing full well the original result was fraudulent (overspending and funny money), and that as Leave voters strongly lent toward being older, a new referendum will see some of them no longer with us, and conversely, plenty of 16 & 17 year olds then now being eligible to vote, not to mention some Leavers finally realising so much of what they were told - £350m for the NHS, lower immigration - were lies. Of course, there are Labour MPs similarly unwilling, having bought into the canard of "but my constituents voted for it!", as if that stops the likes of Steven Baker from not only defying his voters, but cheerleading the process.

From what I've read, the People's Vote brigade deliberately haven't moved yet, feeling they've only got one shot at this, and need - unfortunately - to wait until the last minute. Does anyone have insight into what they're hoping to bring about first? I'm guessing that'll be after the march next Saturday.

I don't know about the People's Vote campaign but I think the predominant feeling amongst People's Vote supporters in the Parliamentary Labour Party is that the best -- indeed, the only -- chance of getting Parliament to agree to a second referendum is when it's the only alternative to a no-deal Brexit.

The voting figures from last week explain why -- 84 MPs voted for the amendment backing a second referendum, 333 voted against and 228 abstained. So even had all the abstainers (predominantly Labour but some Conservatives and Independents), it would still have been lost, 333 vs 312. So there's a way to go yet before it's safe to call it.

According to somewhat unclear article in PoliticsHome,

Labour has edged towards backing a second referendum on Brexit after it failed to secure a general election - in line with its official policy agreed at party conference last year.

It has tasked backbenchers Peter Kyle and Phil Wilson to prepare an amendment demanding any Brexit deal agreed by MPs is put to the public in a referendum.

The Hove and Sedgefield MPs are still expecting to table their amendment before the next so-called meaningful vote on the Brexit deal Theresa May brought back from Brussels.

But a Labour source said it would make more sense to push the Commons into backing a referendum once MPs had settled on the withdrawal plan.

“It would be difficult to win support for putting a proposition to the public before that proposition is agreed,” they said.

“It could have the added benefit of being a bid to unite the country - giving it something to coalesce around once the debate on the deal is finished - rather than dividing it further.”

They added: “If the Government passes its deal then it is reasonable to bring it back to the people to make sure they are happy with what is on offer.”

However, it continues

But Mr Kyle insisted claims that Labour would wait until after a Brexit deal is agreed before backing a fresh referendum were “categorically not true”.

“Labour will either table an amendment on a confirmatory vote or support Phil and mine, which will go down on, or before, the next meaningful vote,” he said.

“Phil and I will be tabling soon and Labour will be supporting and I have been given nothing to make me believe otherwise.”

So it looks as if we should expect something in the near future, though a lot has to depend on what happens, or seems to be about to happen, next week.

 

[Porsupah Ree]

However, it continues

But Mr Kyle insisted claims that Labour would wait until after a Brexit deal is agreed before backing a fresh referendum were “categorically not true”.

“Labour will either table an amendment on a confirmatory vote or support Phil and mine, which will go down on, or before, the next meaningful vote,” he said.

So it looks as if we should expect something in the near future, though a lot has to depend on what happens, or seems to be about to happen, next week.

I'm very much hoping Kyle's correct - whilst I can see the logic behind first defining the deal which would be voted on, I feel that's somewhat irrelevant (you don't need to know what car you'll rent on vacation before you plan for it), as well as going to remain difficult to pass without this very kind of voter approval. Are there enough Tories willing to let the plebs have a say? Hopefully. Gods, I hope so.

Of course, even with a PV coming, that doesn't mean this wretched folly will just yet be laid to rest, but hopefully the Remainers will be able to ram home all the lies and deceptions that were wagered, along with those prize quotes selected by Led By Donkeys, as well as doing everything to ensure as many of the new voters do turn out.

 

[Sid]

There's a suggestion in the papers today that the EU may require a second referendum as part of any extension. Might just be a 'frightener' leak from a brexiteer, but would be great if it actually happened.

There was no referendum needed to trigger A50, so why on earth should a referendum all of a sudden be required?
If that was needed, the EU would have warned the UK over and over already.

So I guess it is another good old EU bashing, to sell the papers.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

Are there enough Tories willing to let the plebs have a say? Hopefully. Gods, I hope so.

I think the main problem is the 17 Labour MPs who voted with the government against the People's Vote amendment. They're the ones who have to be persuaded to support a second referendum. I'm sure some of them are persuadable, now that they can tell their constituents they tried to stop it, but they're the ones to work on.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

There was no referendum needed to trigger A50, so why on earth should a referendum all of a sudden be required?
If that was needed, the EU would have warned the UK over and over already.

So I guess it is another good old EU bashing, to sell the papers.

The reasoning behind a second referendum is that a considerable number of MPs (Conservative and Labour both) are worried about the electoral consequences for them personally if they vote to stop Brexit, so they think they need the plausible cover provided by a second referendum (assuming it ends in a Remain vote).

Perhaps they can justly be condemned for their self-serving attitude, but that doesn't seem to worry them so much as does the danger of incurring the wrath of some of their local electorate and (in the case of the Conservatives, their local Conservative Association).

 

[Innula Zenovka]

350 people sign up for Farage's "March to Leave" 100 turn up.

Nigel Farage will not complete Brexit Betrayal march despite urging supporters to join him


This is a 200 mile march. Except for the bits that will be done on buses. Farage will only do "some" of it. Which means popping up for photo ops.
Mean while "led by donkeys" has managed to find enough funds to send a billboard truck along which will play adverts highlighting Farage's lies the whole way.



Now these are middle aged to elderly people who have apparently 'self certified' themselves as fit for this event.



Given the demographic that's doing the walking I fear the numbers may be somewhat depleted by the time they arrive.

They're already getting their excuses in: