Brexit.

[Khamon]

How can the backstop realistically not be indefinite if it's ever deemed necessary and implemented?

 

[Innula Zenovka]

This has aged well

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

So basically Theresa May decided to make her government of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland the EU's laughing stock by her announcement that she wants to renegotiate parts of the agreement, while the EU always said that this is the last and final offer, and stood remarkably close together through all negotiations so far.

It is really delusional to expect that fundamental changes to the back stop might be still possible, while this has always been planned as a transitional rule from the beginning, which would be revoked when the real trade agreement has been finalized.

 

[Luisa Land]

I could not spend much time to follow the debate in the House of Commons today
What I understand : the Brexit-vote, which were intended to take place tomorrow is called off
postponed for next year.

Is the plan to postpone this vote of the Parliament to a date just before the UK will leave the EU , so that the situation wiill be: MPs can only vote for this deal or for leaving the EU without a deal?
And will the Parliament accept this. Or can they change this plan by resolutions to hold the vote earlier or change the pariamentary procedure?

 

[Luisa Land]

just found this gem:

"British politics has finally cut all links with normality and drifted off into absurdity. In the Commons a moment ago Labour’s Rupa Huq described the decision to call off the vote as an act of “premature parliamentary ejaculation”. In response, Theresa May said that, if Huq were to look carefully, she would see that May is not capable of premature ejaculation. "
"God knows what they make of this nonsense in Brussels ... "

May makes Commons statement after calling off key Brexit vote – Politics live

 

[Khamon]

Today's discussion devolved into "I refer my right honourable colleague to my previous answer" and ejaculation references. May is convinced that the only issue with the deal is the indefinite nature of the backstop, that the EU will agree to remove the indefinite terminology, and that the House will vote to approve the deal given that provision. She is equally convinced, or doesn't care, that border have trade are open out Ireland over respect hard there no partial NI by mass intricate. That's the best transcription I can give to answers related to questions concerning NI.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

I could not spend much time to follow the debate in the House of Commons today
What I understand : the Brexit-vote, which were intended to take place tomorrow is called off
postponed for next year.

Is the plan to postpone this vote of the Parliament to a date just before the UK will leave the EU , so that the situation wiill be: MPs can only vote for this deal or for leaving the EU without a deal?
And will the Parliament accept this. Or can they change this plan by resolutions to hold the vote earlier or change the pariamentary procedure?

It all seems to turn on arcane points of parliamentary procedure, but it looks as if the government can schedule the vote for when they want. The Speaker was very clearly angry about the government's behaviour, though, so I would think that, if there is a way for MPs to force a vote, he'll do what he can to facilitate that.

At the moment, the plan seems to go back to Brussels, yet again, and see if there's some form of words available to ease some MPs' concerns about the NI backstop. There probably won't be, but Theresa May must think she needs to be seen to be making every effort to deal with their concerns.

I think, while she's there, she'll also be having confidential discussions about how to extend the A50 process to give the UK time to hold a second referendum -- not because she wants one but because it's the only way to resolve the impasse other than "no deal" which no one apart from a minority of Brexit fanatics wants.

I know she's ruled out a second referendum, but she'd ruled out postponing today's vote, too, until she did postpone it, and she also ruled out calling a general election in 2017, too, so I don't see that her ruling out a second referendum means it's not going to happen.

So, while it's by no means certain, I think we're slowly moving towards a referendum on Remain vs Accept the Withdrawal Agreement. That's the only way out I can see that would be acceptable to the EU.

 

[Tigger]

She doesn't seem to hold to any promise given to anyone. Theresa May is the "form of words" PM, desperately trying different ways of saying the same thing that sound different enough to trick someone who isn't listening carefully enough.

 

[Chin Rey]

She doesn't seem to hold to any promise given to anyone.

If that is the case, how about a really convoluted conspiracy theory? What if May is deliberately trying to sabotage Brexit? She was a remainer herself, remember and it's hard to see how calling off the vote can benefit anybody but the people proposing a second referendum.

Yes, I know it makes no sense at all but then again, what else does in this farce? ;-)

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

You do mean something like this parody of her?

 

[Innula Zenovka]

The best explanation of the whole Brexit debacle I've seen in a long time. You should read it.

 

[Erich Templar]

Oh god, the cheese puns in the replies...!

 

[Porsupah Ree]

Wherein we also learned there was a German submarine with a La Vache Qui Rit emblem. ^_^

German submarine U-69 (1940) - Wikipedia

U-69 was unusual in that she had two ships' emblems. The first, adopted on commissioning, was chosen by her first commander, Metzler. This consisted of the word Horrido (Tally-Ho) and the three two-flag signal groups for the letters L M A, a reference to Gotz von Berlichingen’s famous scatological retort.[12] The second came about when the 7th flotilla adopted Prien’s bull emblem as its flotilla insignia. U-69's new first officer, who had not seen the insignia before, found a picture of a cow on a French cheese box, and had that painted on the conning tower, complete with the motto on the box "la vache qui rit" (the laughing cow). When Metzler saw it, he decided to keep it, as it raised a laugh with all who saw it, and the crew adopted the slogan as a war-cry; U-69 thereafter became known as the "laughing cow".

 

[Casey Pelous]

Go home, world; you're drunk.

 

[Pamela]

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/claudiakoerner/a-member-of-parliament-grabbed-the-mace?bftwnews&utm_term=4ldqpgc#4ldqpgc

So adorably British. No wonder I love them so.

 

[Porsupah Ree]

 

[Porsupah Ree]

Interesting, though not very suprising, to see the shift is essentially from "leave with a deal" to "remain", with the "burn it to the ground" brigade remaining a firm minority.

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

Didn't knew that the House of Commons is only officially being able to meet and pass laws, if the parliamentary mace is in it, which symbolizes the royal power; normally it is located quite visible on an open desk. It is being transported there in some kind of procession.

Labour MP Lloyd Russell-Moyle picked it up today, and tried to walk out with it; without the mace being in place the House of Commons probably would have to disband for the rest of the day. Taking it of the table is something unthinkable to do so, so all people were quite shocked, but he was held before he was being able to leave the room and was expelled from the meeting for the rest of the day.

 

[Erich Templar]

I assume he was trying to make some sort of point/protest, but I've no idea what.

 

[Porsupah Ree]

And to absolutely nobody's surprise:

EU president tells Theresa May Brexit deal renegotiation 'will not happen'

There is “no room whatsoever” to renegotiate the Brexit deal, the president of the European Commission has said, ahead of Theresa May’s trip to Brussels to seek concessions. Speaking in the European Parliament on Tuesday Jean-Claude Juncker said re-opening the withdrawal agreement “will not happen”.

So, what actually is the point of all this? To get to this point, May has had to pull an unprecedented stunt in pulling a vote, which seems to put even the Speaker into unfamiliar procedural territory, as well as plenty of highly deserved ridicule - for what? She surely knows there's no room for any further negotiations - not because the EU's "acting tough", but because logically, the backstop is necessary. What does she hope to gain - is it purely the symbolism of "well, look, I tried! This really is the absolute best we can do"? If so, that mightn't be a bad thing, although I imagine there'll still be plenty of Leavers adopting the No True Brexiteer mindset that if only they had been given the opportunity to negotiate..