Toward 2020

Jolene Benoir

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Sep 20, 2018
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Nope, since feminists have always been fighters you are in reality nothing more than a pessimist, underestimating your own country and women on equal terms.
We can still be fighters, but there is no point in losing the whole war and believe me, we are in a fight for our country. But you're not from here are you? It's easy enough for you to tell us what we should do or make judgments about it.

Make no mistake. I am not underestimating ANY woman out there. I think there are more than enough highly qualified female candidates. I OVERestimated my countrymen and women in 2016. That won't happen again.
 
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Jolene Benoir

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Sep 20, 2018
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I could see someone like Warren at the top of a ticket. Of course it is WAY too early to decide who is the most progressive candidate to support, but her and a few others are fighters. Can you imagine a ticket with her and Tammy Duckworth? I would almost feel sorry for any R who threw shade at them. Well, except for donnie himself of course, he would try but would not get very far.
The problem with a fighter (though I don't have any issue with the premise) is that Donnie will always stoop to a new low level. Always. Then, it becomes who can wrangle around in the mud in a way that appeals to people who enjoy that more. It's a pretty good bet that people who are attracted to voting for Trump enjoy that much more than anyone else.
 

Kara Spengler

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Sep 20, 2018
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The problem with a fighter (though I don't have any issue with the premise) is that Donnie will always stoop to a new low level. Always. Then, it becomes who can wrangle around in the mud in a way that appeals to people who enjoy that more. It's a pretty good bet that people who are attracted to voting for Trump enjoy that much more than anyone else.
The instant donnie goes after duckworth he loses the military and anyone who even gives lip service to patriotism. She is about as patriotic as you can come while still living. Not only that but a mother to boot.
 

Cristalle

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Sep 24, 2018
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The instant donnie goes after duckworth he loses the military and anyone who even gives lip service to patriotism. She is about as patriotic as you can come while still living. Not only that but a mother to boot.
NO he doesn't. Look at how they turn on the generals after speaking out. He may lose some, but that hardcore base of idiots will stay with him through and through. It's a cult.
 

Kara Spengler

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NO he doesn't. Look at how they turn on the generals after speaking out. He may lose some, but that hardcore base of idiots will stay with him through and through. It's a cult.
I was mostly talking about the military, which often skews R. They value someone who sacrificed for the country much more than rank.
 
Sep 19, 2018
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They have basically been trained to see anything that ends with 'ism' as a synonym. Fascism, socialism, communism, anarchism, etc .... they are all the same.

Do not think about that one too long or your brain will hurt.

They no longer remember their baptism. If they honestly looked in a prism they would better appreciate their organism and nudism, or even become someone with heroism.
 

Veritable Quandry

Specializing in derails and train wrecks.
Sep 19, 2018
379
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The instant donnie goes after duckworth he loses the military and anyone who even gives lip service to patriotism. She is about as patriotic as you can come while still living. Not only that but a mother to boot.
Do you have any idea how popular McCain was with military members? Even those who disagreed with his politics generally respected him. Trump attacked a military veteran and former POW with a long history of military service and service to the military as a Senator, and nothing happened. So what makes you think that attacking a veteran from the Democratic Party will have any impact on his base?
 

Kara Spengler

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Do you have any idea how popular McCain was with military members? Even those who disagreed with his politics generally respected him. Trump attacked a military veteran and former POW with a long history of military service and service to the military as a Senator, and nothing happened. So what makes you think that attacking a veteran from the Democratic Party will have any impact on his base?
Yes I know how popular he was. Both are extremely popular in the disability community as well. In fact she shared a disability award with McCain (posthumously awarded) the other month. McCain played nice though and I can not see Duckworth doing the same (but coming out of it not having stooped to donnie's level).

Duckworth Awarded U.S. International Council on Disabilities’ Dole-Harkin Award for Her Leadership in Advancing Disability Rights | U.S. Senator Tammy Duckworth of Illinois
 

Cristalle

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Sep 24, 2018
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I was mostly talking about the military, which often skews R. They value someone who sacrificed for the country much more than rank.
I am ex-military and I still see plenty of cult members among them, they don't budge regardless of how obnoxious Trump gets. McCain, McRaven, McChrystal... damn that's a lot of Mc's... Mattis... they turn on them when they go after Trump. You should see some of the smears about Mattis. Because he believed in climate change, he had to go.... yeah, no. They are a solid cult, and Trump is one of theirs. He would have to have gay sex in public or become transgender for them to abandon him.
 

Jolene Benoir

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Sep 20, 2018
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I am ex-military and I still see plenty of cult members among them, they don't budge regardless of how obnoxious Trump gets. McCain, McRaven, McChrystal... damn that's a lot of Mc's... Mattis... they turn on them when they go after Trump. You should see some of the smears about Mattis. Because he believed in climate change, he had to go.... yeah, no. They are a solid cult, and Trump is one of theirs. He would have to have gay sex in public or become transgender for them to abandon him.
Yeah, if they haven't turned on him now, they won't. He has attacked numerous high profile people who served their country and has attacked family members of fallen soldiers. Why they like him at all mystifies me. He wheedled his own way out of serving with his bone spurs, he has no respect for protocol or anything else that the military respects. The only thing I can think of is that he is easily manipulated so they can expect budged increases. I suppose a few hawks like his bullying posture.
 

Katheryne Helendale

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Sep 20, 2018
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Yeah, if they haven't turned on him now, they won't. He has attacked numerous high profile people who served their country and has attacked family members of fallen soldiers. Why they like him at all mystifies me. He wheedled his own way out of serving with his bone spurs, he has no respect for protocol or anything else that the military respects. The only thing I can think of is that he is easily manipulated so they can expect budged increases. I suppose a few hawks like his bullying posture.
That, and his hard stance on border security, which is a subject near and dear to a lot of military and veterans. If Trump gave up his border wall idea, I think there'd be a falling out in the military ranks.
 
Sep 21, 2018
91
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Yeah, if they haven't turned on him now, they won't. He has attacked numerous high profile people who served their country and has attacked family members of fallen soldiers. Why they like him at all mystifies me. He wheedled his own way out of serving with his bone spurs, he has no respect for protocol or anything else that the military respects. The only thing I can think of is that he is easily manipulated so they can expect budged increases. I suppose a few hawks like his bullying posture.
People have been treating the authoritarianism of the Trump followers as if it was a politics. It’s not a politics. It’s a cult and a psychology and a culture. The smarter Trumpians know what’s going on, but don’t share our values and a core of those are still unhappy they lost the War Between the States. There’s no way for politicians who like our Constitution the way it is to reach these people.

The only way to reach them is deconversion, exactly like leaving a cult religion. It’s a very tall order that goes way beyond politics. Throwing information at the Trump voters will pick off the edges, which can change close elections. I don’t think the core can be changed by anything but slow cultural and generational change.

It’s worth doing. It’s just a lot more work than people who are unfamiliar with this kind of thinking realize.
 
Sep 21, 2018
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That, and his hard stance on border security, which is a subject near and dear to a lot of military and veterans. If Trump gave up his border wall idea, I think there'd be a falling out in the military ranks.
What I’m seeing here in Arizona is the way supporting the wall is being treated as a cultural identifier by Right wing whites who adhere to a kind of siege mentality. It’s not hidden at all; I kept hearing it on TV in campaign ads.

Smarter people must realize a physical wall is trivial to overcome. The whole thing is dog whistling to the paranoid.

Low information voters are scared and don’t accurately know why, and reasoning with them doesn’t work. Arguing with them sooner or later reveals a lack of understanding about how the system really works. They get enraged by the exposure of their ignorance.

The only idea I have is fighting for a much better educational system. People can deconvert themselves from a cult if they can access critical thinking and fact checking, which also fixes the problem of paranoid fear.
 

Pamela

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Oct 7, 2018
321
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I am so enjoying watching coverage of the new House of Representatives. :love::p:D(y)
 

Pamela

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Oct 7, 2018
321
Austin
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And if it had not been for Donald Trump I would not be regarding this development as an absolute miracle.
 
Oct 29, 2018
89
Hmmm..I have been thinking about this a fair amount and have come to a conclusion that I do not like, but I believe that might well be necessary if we want to win the Presidency.

It's simple. Very simple. Do not put a woman at the top of the ticket.

I know. I can hear you gritting your teeth. Me too. I consider myself a feminist and it goes against all I believe, but I also HAVE to see Trump out of office.

I honestly believe that Trump will make hay out of any woman that runs. I believe that men who hate women and more than a few women who don't believe women can serve as President would be exactly the tipping point that he would need to win again. I believe they were last time. The existence of the Bernie bros pretty much says it all. Trump was ideologically the opposite of Bernie, yet some voted for him. You see, people don't really need much of an excuse to hate on a powerful female. I don't know if it's fear or hate, but it doesn't matter; the result is the same. We lose again and I really don't want to think about what this country would be like with Trump and his gang of thieves and hooligans for another 6 years.

I would like to see a female President in my lifetime. Damn, I really really do believe we have earned that and I believe we deserve it, but this country is too backassward and it's particularly heated up by the presence of the little Toad-man himself.
I really feel the opposite.

No matter who runs against him, the attacks will be the same. Besides, not only did HRC get a comfortable majority, the midterms showed women having high approval.

I hate to put things in misogynistic terms, but -
Government is a mess right now. If it has to be explained that we're perfectly fine with men leading government as soon as women have had time to clean up the mess, so be it.

I have every intention of giving a female candidate higher priority right now. Preferring Harris myself, but any of them that wants to run, should. Her and Warren both should be able to get support from most Democrats in the end, even if either looks like they're taking hits from skeptics now. As capable as Biden is, I think Democrats are ready to bypass the older white guys.
 

Cristalle

Lady of the House
Sep 24, 2018
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I think that focusing on identity alone is a mistake. I am a policy person. I don't care if it comes from an old white guy, a young woman of color, or a trans person of any stripe. It's wonderful to make history, but history is not enoughif they won't make meaningful moves on healthcare, climate change, etc. Biden is capable but if he takes the wrong policy positions (and in a couple of areas I think he would, thus my objection), then he should go. But his white maleness should not be a disqualifier alone.
 

Kaimi Kyomoon

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Oct 12, 2018
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I think that focusing on identity alone is a mistake. I am a policy person. I don't care if it comes from an old white guy, a young woman of color, or a trans person of any stripe. It's wonderful to make history, but history is not enoughif they won't make meaningful moves on healthcare, climate change, etc. Biden is capable but if he takes the wrong policy positions (and in a couple of areas I think he would, thus my objection), then he should go. But his white maleness should not be a disqualifier alone.
Beto?