Nobody Cares: PRS

Jolene Benoir

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I am not getting back into that thread. We have disagreements over what constitutes alt-right talking points and stuff, and I have zero intention or reliving all of that. Look, or don't, and that's all I have to say about it.
You see this right here?

If you can't parse out when sources you don't like say something true, I am sorry for you.
That is your words. YOU not only brought in the very same disreputable source that caused so much contention in the other thread, you just had to have a dig at those who objected in the first place.

Don't pretend to be taking the high road now.
 
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That Jimmy Dore post had nothing to do with the ending fallout of that thread? C'mon, you've carried water long enough, don't you think?
My guess is it had to do with unnecessarily angry and aggressive attitudes in general however I certainly can't speak for Cris.
 

Cristalle

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You see this right here?



That is your words. YOU not only brought in the very same disreputable source that caused so much contention in the other thread, you just had to have a dig at those who objected in the first place.

Don't pretend to be taking the high road now.
For the last time, I'm not going to bend over backwards for anyone here. You can look, or not. You can choose to parse the information or not. I'm not going to argue with anybody here. Sick of it.
 

Innula Zenovka

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Just wondering, so as I don't accidentally un-ignore the wrong person, who's the arsehole?
Until I encountered this thread, I was blissfully unaware of Mr Dore and his oeuvre, so I looked him up: Jimmy Dore - Wikipedia

Since, as Jolene notes, the story about the municipal grocery store was widely covered elsewhere, I wonder if considerations other than the story itself may not have been at work in selecting so contentious a vehicle for discussing the it here.

However, it would be unfair to impute ulterior motives without evidence, so I can assume only that Cristalle wanted to share with us the story but, like me, was unaware of Mr Dore's somewhat dubious record and didn't realise his apparently enthusiastic embrace of various right-wing conspiracy theories and talking points would offend some people and detract from the story itself.
 
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Bartholomew Gallacher

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However, it would be unfair to impute ulterior motives without evidence, so I can assume only that Cristalle wanted to share with us the story but, like me, was unaware of Mr Dore's somewhat dubious record and didn't realise his apparently enthusiastic embrace of various right-wing conspiracy theories and talking points would offend some people and detract from the story itself.
"Don't complain about the source. If you can't parse out when sources you don't like say something true, I am sorry for you." - NOPE. You are wrong.
 

Beebo Brink

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I enjoy debating politics, even when it drives me crazy, and I've been right in the middle of the rough-and-tumble of several presidential cycles here on SLU/VVO.

Something is different this cycle. Something is off-kilter and disturbing, I can feel it in the pit of my stomach. Props to those of you who are calling it out, but it doesn't seem to make any difference. Like all of social media, we seem to lack the tools -- both emotional and technical -- to fight this off. We're still playing by the old rules, and we're losing.
 
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I enjoy debating politics, even when it drives me crazy, and I've been right in the middle of the rough-and-tumble of several presidential cycles here on SLU/VVO.

Something is different this cycle. Something is off-kilter and disturbing, I can feel it in the pit of my stomach. Props to those of you who are calling it out, but it doesn't seem to make any difference. Like all of social media, we seem to lack the tools -- both emotional and technical -- to fight this off. We're still playing by the old rules, and we're losing.
I've been through several cycles on SLU too. I think I joined in 2005. 2015/6 was pretty rough. I changed to two different av names there because I got too wound up in it, then finally changed back to Essence after it was over. Now I still make some comments that are not taken kindly to but have mostly dialed it back. Mostly people have made up their minds about things anyway.
 

Jolene Benoir

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Until I encountered this thread, I was blissfully unaware of Mr Dore and his oeuvre, so I looked him up: Jimmy Dore - Wikipedia

Since, as Jolene notes, the story about the municipal grocery store was widely covered elsewhere, I wonder if considerations other than the story itself may not have been at work in selecting so contentious a vehicle for discussing the it here.

However, it would be unfair to impute ulterior motives without evidence, so I can assume only that Cristalle wanted to share with us the story but, like me, was unaware of Mr Dore's somewhat dubious record and didn't realise his apparently enthusiastic embrace of various right-wing conspiracy theories and talking points would offend some people and detract from the story itself.
She knew. She was part of the contentious thread. His history was discussed there. She defended it there, as well and was every bit a part of any unpleasantness as anyone else. It was a direct jab.
 

Cristalle

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I am keeping this simple. For 140+ pages no one said anything. In a year, I hadn't seen anything like what you said. So my lived experience was not that of "this guy is a conspiracy theory nutter" but something else entirely. But after what happened in that thread, my fucks went to zero. I will never post something knowing that it's untrue. That's my only real consideration. And I am not arguing with people about it. You're dragging it on. Blast me if I put up something that is actually untrue, I'll the take the L and make the correction. But if it's true and you don't like the source? Sorry, not sorry.
 

Innula Zenovka

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I am keeping this simple. For 140+ pages no one said anything. In a year, I hadn't seen anything like what you said. So my lived experience was not that of "this guy is a conspiracy theory nutter" but something else entirely. But after what happened in that thread, my fucks went to zero. I will never post something knowing that it's untrue. That's my only real consideration. And I am not arguing with people about it. You're dragging it on. Blast me if I put up something that is actually untrue, I'll the take the L and make the correction. But if it's true and you don't like the source? Sorry, not sorry.
The question, to my mind, is whether you're more interested in promoting discussion of the content of the story or of the contentious source you've chosen to use to promote it.

If you intended to get people talking about Mr Dore, then you've succeeded admirably.

However, if you intended to get people talking about the town's excursion into municipal socialism, then things might have gone rather better had you chosen a different source but at least now you know what to do next time, assuming you want to discuss the story rather than the storyteller.
 

Cristalle

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The question, to my mind, is whether you're more interested in promoting discussion of the content of the story or of the contentious source you've chosen to use to promote it.

If you intended to get people talking about Mr Dore, then you've succeeded admirably.

However, if you intended to get people talking about the town's excursion into municipal socialism, then things might have gone rather better had you chosen a different source but at least now you know what to do next time, assuming you want to discuss the story rather than the storyteller.
I am not here to advocate for any source. I care more about the underlying story. I would rather have talked about Baldwin, FL and the town's approach than Jimmy Dore himself. I also happened to think that Jimmy's commentary about it was spot on. The things he highlighted about what the mayor said were true.
 

Jolene Benoir

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I am keeping this simple. For 140+ pages no one said anything. In a year, I hadn't seen anything like what you said. So my lived experience was not that of "this guy is a conspiracy theory nutter" but something else entirely. But after what happened in that thread, my fucks went to zero. I will never post something knowing that it's untrue. That's my only real consideration. And I am not arguing with people about it. You're dragging it on. Blast me if I put up something that is actually untrue, I'll the take the L and make the correction. But if it's true and you don't like the source? Sorry, not sorry.
You keep repeating that for 140+ pages no one said anything about the sources you and others were using. That's blatantly false. Multiple people spoke up during the longevity of that thread, questioning the sources being promoted.

Yes, I understand that you want to keep promoting this quack, and in this case, you wanted to have a jab at those who oppose the usage of sources that are not only questionable but downright destructive.

I also understand that you watch said quack regularly and thus might be your only source, but in the real world out here, there are and were multiple trusted sources that reported on the town of Baldwin.
 
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Innula Zenovka

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So, with hindsight, would you not agree that it would have been more effective to quote a less contentious source for the story?
I am not here to advocate for any source. I care more about the underlying story. I would rather have talked about Baldwin, FL and the town's approach than Jimmy Dore himself. I also happened to think that Jimmy's commentary about it was spot on. The things he highlighted about what the mayor said were true.
With hindsight, do you think you might more effectively have achieved your goal of talking about Baldwin, Fl and the town's approach by choosing a less contentious source?
 

Clara D.

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So, with hindsight, would you not agree that it would have been more effective to quote a less contentious source for the story?

With hindsight, do you think you might more effectively have achieved your goal of talking about Baldwin, Fl and the town's approach by choosing a less contentious source?

IIRC, it should be on *us* to find different sources if we don't like that one. </sarcasm>
 
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Cristalle

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You keep repeating that for 140+ pages no one said anything about the sources you and others were using. That's blatantly false. Multiple people spoke up during the longevity of that thread, questioning the sources being promoted.

Yes, I understand that you want to keep promoting this quack, and in this case, you wanted to have a jab at those who oppose the usage of sources that are not only questionable but downright destructive.

I also understand that you watch said quack regularly and thus might be your only source, but in the real world out here, there are and were multiple trusted sources that reported on the town of Baldwin.
Nobody said anything specific that I could identify as to what the problem was until late in that thread. Vague complaints about sources didn't mean much as I read it mostly as, "I don't agree with so and so."

I'm not promoting *him*. I'm never promoting *him*, that's *never* the point of anything I post. I only put out things that I've seen in my feed, when I care about the subject matter of discussion. In this case, he's the first one to show up in my feeds discussing this subject. As for taking a jab: no. That wasn't the point, either. I was saying that I wasn't going to twist myself into knots to please anyone here, you can take it or leave it. It's not meant as a slight to anyone, just my operating philosophy. I'm tired of repeating myself.

It should also be plainly obvious that no, he's not my only source of information. I am disappointed that you'd use such hyperbole.


So, with hindsight, would you not agree that it would have been more effective to quote a less contentious source for the story?

With hindsight, do you think you might more effectively have achieved your goal of talking about Baldwin, Fl and the town's approach by choosing a less contentious source?
I get it, but like I said - I ran out of fucks and refused to bend over backwards about it. People can watch or read, or they don't. I don't expect to be harangued about it. I don't harass people for stuff I won't read/watch.
 

Jolene Benoir

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Nobody said anything specific that I could identify as to what the problem was until late in that thread. Vague complaints about sources didn't mean much as I read it mostly as, "I don't agree with so and so."

I'm not promoting *him*. I'm never promoting *him*, that's *never* the point of anything I post. I only put out things that I've seen in my feed, when I care about the subject matter of discussion. In this case, he's the first one to show up in my feeds discussing this subject. As for taking a jab: no. That wasn't the point, either. I was saying that I wasn't going to twist myself into knots to please anyone here, you can take it or leave it. It's not meant as a slight to anyone, just my operating philosophy. I'm tired of repeating myself.

It should also be plainly obvious that no, he's not my only source of information. I am disappointed that you'd use such hyperbole.
They were not vague complaints, and you are well aware of that, as well. If he's not your only source of information, then you simply used him here to raise a hair on the neck of those who consider him scum.

I get it, but like I said - I ran out of fucks and refused to bend over backwards about it. People can watch or read, or they don't. I don't expect to be harangued about it. I don't harass people for stuff I won't read/watch.
I've run out of fucks and will not be giving a pass to posts that blatantly promote scumbags like Jimmy Dore.