#JAILTOTHECHIEF- Shit Just Got Real

Innula Zenovka

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This is from an article that's primarily about Boris Johnson and Nigel Farage, but it skewers their idol perfectly:
In many ways, there can be no greater therapist’s case study than Trump. If – like many of us at times in our lives – you are one of those people who thinks they’d feel better about themselves if they only got that promotion/ earned more money/ were more successful in whichever way, then will you just look at this guy. LOOK AT HIM. He’s the actual president of the actual United States of America, and he still spends half his time tweeting on the bog, horrifyingly weakly, about people who should be so far below his sight line as to not even remotely register. What a reminder that it’s really not about how you do externally. Unless you take care of your shit, it’s still there inside, gnawing you to bits, and it never goes away. For all his unrivalled power and immense wealth, Donald Trump is by far and away the most insecure person most of us have ever seen.
 
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Innula Zenovka

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Still more on Sir Kim Darroch's resignation, which seems to have disgusted many Conservatives -- Tories who are fanatical about Brexit because they want to escape from what they see as the country's subservience to the EU are hardly likely to be impressed by Johnson, in effect, signalling his intention to sack Sir Kim on Trump's orders:

 
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Innula Zenovka

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To be fair, I think the significance of the fact the leak may have damaged UK international relations is probably one of the triggers for an investigation under whatever the relevant law is.

This means that the investigation into the leak has now taken on a life of its own, at least for the time being, independent of any political or administrative considerations and decisions.
 

Soen Eber

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This means that the investigation into the leak has now taken on a life of its own, at least for the time being, independent of any political or administrative considerations and decisions.
Are leak inquirys "serious business" now or are they still a cover for pretending to look into things the public will forget about in a year's time? I would think the Foreign & Commonwealth Office would be "plenty hot" about this - it strikes at the very core of diplomatic activity - telling the truth to the people who need to know.
 

Innula Zenovka

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There are (or have been) some internal "leak inquiries" already. I would imagine what's happened is that one of these internal inquiries has reached the conclusion that something happened that may have crossed the criminal threshold and that this information has been passed to the police under whatever the regular procedure is under the Civil Service Code.

The Met's announcement is, in effect, an acknowledgement that, at first sight, there appears to be sufficient evidence to trigger a full criminal investigation, and they'll take it forward.

From everything we read, the FCO and Whitehall in general is livid about this. As are a lot of people -- whoever leaked this broke a very fundamental rule indeed, and that is attracting all sorts of civil service and legal ire, quite apart from the Conservative leadership contest.
 

Innula Zenovka

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What's 45 got on Boris Johnson that he can order him to do anything? Or has he promised him a stake in the next Trump Tower or something?
A lot of his "Leave the EU by October 31, deal or no deal, do or die! " rhetoric is based on the assumption that the UK will rapidly be able to compensate for the ill-effects of no-deal by immediately signing a free trade agreement with the USA, preferably in Latin, that guarantees everyone all the genetically modified US unicorns they can eat, and they can have them too.

So presumably he wasn't going to take the risk of alienating the orange king sufficiently to have him tweeting about what a fat idiot Johnson is, and doesn't he have ridiculous hair, all the way through the next few days.

Rather, come to think of it, what do the people have on Johnson who caused Sir Kim's diplomatic cables to be released?
 
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Bartholomew Gallacher

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No, I don't think so. This episode is really going badly for Boris Johnson. He is roundly disliked and distrusted by many Conservative MPs, and they're taking the opportunity to express their unhappiness about the leader their party members seem about to impose on them.
And I strongly disagree on that.

First on the former ambassador Darroch: I guess that this man was professional enough to recognize that this leak damaged the working relationship between him and the American government so much that there is no such thing since then, that he's got no chance but to resign, because otherwise London has no voice to be heared in Washington, D.C., any longer. Maybe he needed a little bit of convincing by his government first, or was just asked for to leave; if so, we'll never find out, because they surely won't tell the public about it if so.

Second on the relationship: it really doesn't matter who is in the oval office. The UK governments have since decades in most of the Western European countries the image of being the well trained poodles of America, the American submarine within the EU and its predecessor organizations - and this comes not without reasons. So in other words: since the UK governments have been a well known citizen of the American rectum since decades, they don't have to kiss the ass, because they've mastered the higher level of enlighted friendship long ago. Like many other European countries as well by the way, and this is then euphemistically being called the transatlantic friendship .

Third: when Johnson really leaves the EU without deal or whatsoever, he can only get a good deal with Trump if he's being a good, sneaky sycophant. Easy as that, because the British nuclear arms won't impress America, since the UK is in the NATO unlike North Korea.

So far we've seen nothing yet to destroy this special relationship - and I am pretty sure under Johnson it just will flourish to unknown heights, maybe finally moving into the American stomach.
 
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Kara Spengler

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And I strongly disagree on that.

First on the former ambassador Darroch: I guess that this man was professional enough to recognize that this leak damaged the working relationship between him and the American government so much that there is no such thing since then, that he's got no chance but to resign, because otherwise London has no voice to be heared in Washington, D.C., any longer. Maybe he needed a little bit of convincing by his government first, or was just asked for to leave; if so, we'll never find out, because they surely won't tell the public about it if so.

Second on the relationship: it really doesn't matter who is in the oval office. The UK governments have since decades in most of the Western European countries the image of being the well trained poodles of America, the American submarine within the EU and its predecessor organizations - and this comes not without reasons. So in other words: since the UK governments have been a well known citizen of the American rectum since decades, they don't have to kiss the ass, because they've mastered the higher level of enlighted friendship long ago. Like many other European countries as well by the way, and this is then euphemistically being called the transatlantic friendship .

Third: when Johnson really leaves the EU without deal or whatsoever, he can only get a good deal with Trump if he's being a good, sneaky sycophant. Easy as that, because the British nuclear arms won't impress America, since the UK is in the NATO unlike North Korea.

So far we've seen nothing yet to destroy this special relationship - and I am pretty sure under Johnson it just will flourish to unknown heights, maybe finally moving into the American stomach.
Actually, in normal times it would not matter who was in the WH. These are not normal times though.

As we know donnie changes on a dime from friend to foe or the other way around. One of the things the pro-brexit camp keeps yelling is they will get a deal with the US as soon as they break away from the EU. What happens if donnie renegs? It might be too late to stop brexit but it would end quite a few political careers.
 

Ashiri

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Actually, in normal times it would not matter who was in the WH. These are not normal times though.

As we know donnie changes on a dime from friend to foe or the other way around. One of the things the pro-brexit camp keeps yelling is they will get a deal with the US as soon as they break away from the EU. What happens if donnie renegs? It might be too late to stop brexit but it would end quite a few political careers.
Oh, they might get a deal, but it would be an extremely toxic one.
 

Innula Zenovka

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The whole Brexit project, as far as Johnson is concerned, is based on a complete fantasy project of Britain signing innumerable free trade deal all over the world and becoming a booming, free market, unregulated economy while simultaneously taking back control (and also having blue passports again) and things, because magic, if you believe strongly enough.

Part of this fantasy is a magic free trade deal we sign with the USA that gives us everything we want and the Americans won't insist on any terms we might find unacceptable because special relationship and Anglo-American transatlantic alliance and WWII and stuff. And blue passports.

So this whole episode has given everyone an unappetising glimpse of what kind of transatlantic alliance outside Europe upon which we can expect Johnson to rely as PM, and it's not pretty.
 

Bartholomew Gallacher

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Coming back to 45: the now resigned former UK's ambassador Darroch also wrote back to London why 45 axed the Iran deal - to piss off Obama, simple as that!

After Mr Johnson returned to London, Sir Kim told No 10 in a ‘diptel’ (diplomatic telegram) that Mr Trump’s Administration was ‘set upon an act of diplomatic vandalism’. The Ambassador wrote that Mr Trump appeared to be abandoning the deal for ‘personality reasons’ because it had been agreed by his predecessor Barack Obama.

Sir Kim suggested there were splits among the President’s closest advisers and said the White House lacked a ‘day-after’ strategy on what to do following withdrawal from the Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action, as the deal was called.

This newspaper’s cache of leaked memos from Sir Kim dominated headlines on both sides of the Atlantic last week, after Trump reacted furiously to Sir Kim describing the White House as a ‘uniquely dysfunctional environment’ and ‘diplomatically clumsy and inept’.



So if this is true then the USA are running into their next war against Iran with no plan whatsoever due to Trump's personal obsession with undoing all done by Obama.
 
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Innula Zenovka

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Coming back to 45: the now resigned former UK's ambassador Darroch also wrote back to London why 45 axed the Iran deal - to piss off Obama, simple as that!

After Mr Johnson returned to London, Sir Kim told No 10 in a ‘diptel’ (diplomatic telegram) that Mr Trump’s Administration was ‘set upon an act of diplomatic vandalism’. The Ambassador wrote that Mr Trump appeared to be abandoning the deal for ‘personality reasons’ because it had been agreed by his predecessor Barack Obama.

Sir Kim suggested there were splits among the President’s closest advisers and said the White House lacked a ‘day-after’ strategy on what to do following withdrawal from the Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action, as the deal was called.

This newspaper’s cache of leaked memos from Sir Kim dominated headlines on both sides of the Atlantic last week, after Trump reacted furiously to Sir Kim describing the White House as a ‘uniquely dysfunctional environment’ and ‘diplomatically clumsy and inept’.



So if this is true then the USA are running into their next war against Iran with no plan whatsoever due to Trump's personal obsession with undoing all done by Obama.
To be fair, HMG didn't need a confidential report from the British Ambassador to tell them that -- they could simply follow the same Twitter feeds I do and read the Washington Post and NYT every now and again, and they'd keep on reading much the same thing.
 

Eunoli

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So if this is true then the USA are running into their next war against Iran with no plan whatsoever due to Trump's personal obsession with undoing all done by Obama.
Not completely true. Any war with Iran - or anyone- will also be a means for distraction in the case of the scandal of the day and a means for Trump to win reelection. Incumbents aren't defeated in the US in times of war.
 
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Kara Spengler

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The whole Brexit project, as far as Johnson is concerned, is based on a complete fantasy project of Britain signing innumerable free trade deal all over the world and becoming a booming, free market, unregulated economy while simultaneously taking back control (and also having blue passports again) and things, because magic, if you believe strongly enough.

Part of this fantasy is a magic free trade deal we sign with the USA that gives us everything we want and the Americans won't insist on any terms we might find unacceptable because special relationship and Anglo-American transatlantic alliance and WWII and stuff. And blue passports.

So this whole episode has given everyone an unappetising glimpse of what kind of transatlantic alliance outside Europe upon which we can expect Johnson to rely as PM, and it's not pretty.
Exactly. If donnie gets his fee fees hurt nobody knows (not even him) what he will demand or even if a deal is still on the table .... no matter what he has said before.
 
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