Israel Halts Electricity Supply To Gaza

[Cindy Claveau]

Israel Halts Electricity Supply To Gaza – Energy Minister

This comes after at least 70 people were reported killed in Israel in the conflict's bloodiest escalation in years which also left hundreds more wounded on both sides.

Israel ordered its state-run electricity company to halt supply to the Gaza Strip on Saturday after Palestinian militant group Hamas launched a surprise attack on Israel, the energy minister said.


“I have signed an order instructing (Israel) Electric Company to stop the electricity supply to Gaza,” Energy Minister Israel Katz said in a statement.


Hamas has released images of several Israelis taken captive, and Israel army spokesman Daniel Hagari confirmed that “there are kidnapped soldiers and civilians. I can’t give figures about them at the moment. It’s a war crime committed by Hamas and they will pay the price.”


The Islamist group started the attack around 6:30 am (0330 GMT) with thousands of rockets aimed as far as Tel Aviv and Jerusalem, some bypassing the Iron Dome defence system and hitting buildings.


Hamas fighters — travelling in vehicles, boats and even using motorised paragliders — breached Gaza’s security barrier and attacked nearby Israeli towns and military posts, opening fire on residents and passersby.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

Very good essay by John Ganz here (paywalled, but see evernote link).

Reading, Watching 10.08

A Savage War of Peace

johnganz.substack.com

Evernote link because paywall

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

What I really don't get about this attack is: what's the point of it? Whatever international good will for the palestines might have still been there most surely did just poof away now, and probably will not return in a long time.

So both sides lose, palestines at large scale as well, in fact they are the bigger losers. Nothing gained for them. It's just pointless.

I am pretty sure right now if Israel would wipe out the Gaza strip (which they will not do for sure, because they could have done that with ease for a long time now...) there would be little international protest aside the usual suspects.

 

[Soen Eber]

What I really don't get about this attack is: what's the point of it? Whatever international good will for the palestines might have still been there most surely did just poof away now, and probably will not return in a long time.

So both sides lose, palestines at large scale as well, in fact they are the bigger losers. Nothing gained for them. It's just pointless.

I am pretty sure right now if Israel would wipe out the Gaza strip (which they will not do for sure, because they could have done that with ease for a long time now...) there would be little international protest aside the usual suspects.

The Saudis have been getting closer to Israel lately (along with the smaller gulf states) and Iran is throwing a fit through it's proxy Hamas. The Palestinians in this case are just pawns, as usual. If the Israelis play the long game they'll continue to make good with the Saudis and most everyone else in the region and slowly freeze out Iran and Syria, but with Natenyahu, who knows. There are still factions in the middle east and elsewhere that need the region in chaos and conflict for their own reasons - and don't forget that even when factoring out crusader states Israel there is still the Catholic / Protestant Sunni / Shia split. The fun times are still going on.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

What I really don't get about this attack is: what's the point of it? Whatever international good will for the palestines might have still been there most surely did just poof away now, and probably will not return in a long time.

So both sides lose, palestines at large scale as well, in fact they are the bigger losers. Nothing gained for them. It's just pointless.

I am pretty sure right now if Israel would wipe out the Gaza strip (which they will not do for sure, because they could have done that with ease for a long time now...) there would be little international protest aside the usual suspects.

I think we need to remember that Hamas' assessment of their own interests (and those of their sponsors in Iran) don't necessarily coincide with those of the hapless residents of Gaza as a whole, and that their reading of the situation isn't necessarily accurate.

Having said that, I would think they see the attack as striking a major blow to Benjamin Netanyahu and his government, in that it's destroyed the premise that Israel's missile defence and their surveillance systems have Gaza and the Palestinians well-controlled, so they can safely be ignored.

This attack obviously makes a nonsense of that claim, and will doubtless both destabilise his already shaky coalition with the Israeli far-right and also put a brake on the Saudis' attempts to normalise relations with Israel.

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

Soen Eber: You are forgetting one thing in that theory - in June this year Saudi Arabia and Iran restored their diplomatic relationships after Chinese conveyance. You don't do that and a few months later initiate such a proxy conflict.

Saudi Arabia and Iran Restore Relations: A Victory of Necessity

China surprised the world by brokering relations between Saudi Arabia and Iran, but the two countries have a history of breaking ties. Though Yemen brought the parties to the table, China will have to work to maintain the loose agreement.

www.wilsoncenter.org

 

[Soen Eber]

Soen Eber: You are forgetting one thing in that theory - in June this year Saudi Arabia and Iran restored their diplomatic relationships after Chinese conveyance. You don't do that and a few months later initiate such a proxy conflict.

Saudi Arabia and Iran Restore Relations: A Victory of Necessity

China surprised the world by brokering relations between Saudi Arabia and Iran, but the two countries have a history of breaking ties. Though Yemen brought the parties to the table, China will have to work to maintain the loose agreement.

www.wilsoncenter.org

Yeah, I was having trouble figuring that part of it out as well and Chris Cappy (the creator of the vid) didn't reference it - and he's usually pretty deep into the research on his vids so he's probably trying to square that out as well. I can only chalk that up to how twisted everything is in the Middle East with multiple agendas. Also, Israel was not a part of that conveyance. Nations speak with multiple different voices.

My take is that Iran is banking on Natenyahu to over-react while at the same time reopening the issue on Israel "invulnerability" - cracking open a new can of worms strategically based on lessons learned in Ukrane.

 

[Jolene Benoir]

What I've been reading and seeing about this is absolutely despicable, in particular the attack on the rave and the subsequent parading around of murdered civilian bodies alongside cheering Palestinians. Some people are saying it is Israel's 9/11. Also, from what I've been reading, Hamas leadership lives it up in Qatar, so they are unlikely to face reprisals. It will be the usual people who suffer.

Also, there is a whole lot of blame being pointed at Biden for the $6 billion freeing of Iraninan money in exchange for prisoners. In this particular case, I, too, have my doubts about giving a terrorist sponsoring state that kind of money. I even said as much to myself when I read of it; that at least a portion of it would end up in Hezbollah/Hamas hands.

In any event, I imagine this is going to put a quick end or large wrench in any peace processes/negotiations/opening up of relationships. There are wider implications as well, given that foreign nationals were among the murderered.

 

[Sid]

Man, the world is just so rotten....

 

[Innula Zenovka]

What I've been reading and seeing about this is absolutely despicable, in particular the attack on the rave and the subsequent parading around of murdered civilian bodies alongside cheering Palestinians. Some people are saying it is Israel's 9/11. Also, from what I've been reading, Hamas leadership lives it up in Qatar, so they are unlikely to face reprisals. It will be the usual people who suffer.

Also, there is a whole lot of blame being pointed at Biden for the $6 billion freeing of Iraninan money in exchange for prisoners. In this particular case, I, too, have my doubts about giving a terrorist sponsoring state that kind of money. I even said as much to myself when I read of it; that at least a portion of it would end up in Hezbollah/Hamas hands.

In any event, I imagine this is going to put a quick end or large wrench in any peace processes/negotiations/opening up of relationships. There are wider implications as well, given that foreign nationals were among the murderered.

The funds (which were Iran's to begin with) haven't been returned to Iran. They've been transferred from restricted accounts in South Korea to restricted accounts in Qatar, where they can be used by the Iranian government to buy non-sanctioned materials like food and medicine.

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/09/18/politics/iran-money-explainer/index.html

 

[Jolene Benoir]

The funds (which were Iran's to begin with) haven't been returned to Iran. They've been transferred from restricted accounts in South Korea to restricted accounts in Qatar, where they can be used by the Iranian government to buy non-sanctioned materials like food and medicine.

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/09/18/politics/iran-money-explainer/index.html

Yes, I knew it was their own money. The article mentions strict oversight of the money to ensure that it is only being used for humanitarian purposes (food and medicine). Iran, of course, disputes that it can only be used for food and medicine and says they can use as they wish. I certainly hope that it is extremely strict and that there are no loopholes, no method of diversion. The article also mentions that if they find misuse of the funds, they can lock the accounts. How could there be misuse if there is such strict oversight?

No matter what, these attacks were so very bad and my heart goes out to all who have suffered and their families.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

How could there be misuse if there is such strict oversight?

Presumably the sanction is also available if they discover an attempted fraud and prevent it from being accomplished. And it would somewhat hubristic to say "Our oversight will be so effective we won't need any sanctions because there's no danger of anyone pulling a fast one on us".

 

[GoblinCampFollower]

A lot of the twitter discourse on this is disturbing and I don't want to link to the posts. Some Tankies seem to think Hamas is their friend. Some idiot was cheering the German woman murdered as a "nazi". Most people have been rational enough to point out Hamas chases revenge fantasies and does nothing productive.

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

After reading more press coverage, the whole ugly attack now starts to make sense to me: Saudi Arabia is the anchor here, but not its relationship with Iran, but Israel is the main focus here.

Saudi Arabia was on its was to normalize their relationship to Israel in small steps, and the fate of the palestines was not on the table. Israel had to make little to no concessions for them, they barely talked about the palestines at all. This nomalization would be really important, since Saudi Arabia views itself is the leading muslimic country. And two of the most important muslimic sites are located in Saudi Arabia, so this country has of course influence on several levels.

What a Saudi-Israeli Deal Could Mean for the Palestinians

Biden must push Netanyahu to forgo annexation of the West Bank.

www.foreignaffairs.com

With attacking Israel at that scale this changed radically, it is unlikely that as long a war in Gaza is happening Saudi Arabia will shake hands with the Netanyahu. It's also a clear message to the Arabian world: no deal with Israel above the palestines' heads!

The problem is that Hamas wants Israel to be gone, to be deleted from the map. So with Hamas there will be never peace at all.

Also another thing what most Westerners don't realize is, that most of the muslimic states on the Arabic peninsula don't have much sympathy for the palestines, which they had in the past. In the past many foreign workers in Kuwait, Bahrain, UAE, Saudi Arabia were palestines, today they've been replaced with Indians, Bangladeshis, Pakistanis.

Why? Because the PLO openely supported Saddam Hussein, when he invaded Kuwait back in 1990. The neighboring countries of Kuwait, and Kuwait itself have not forgotten this, what they do view as betrayal. Nobody wants there palestine workers any longer, because their brethren view them as too fanatic.

Of course the bigger picture does involve Russia, China and the USA as well, since all these countries have their own allies in the region as well.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

Scotland's First Minister Humza Yousaf says parents-in-law are trapped in Gaza after Hamas attack on Israel

Mr Yousaf issued an "unequivocal condemnation" of the Hamas attack. He said both he and his wife "cannot sleep" due to worry.

news.sky.com

 

[Essence Lumin]

After reading more press coverage, the whole ugly attack now starts to make sense to me: Saudi Arabia is the anchor here, but not its relationship with Iran, but Israel is the main focus here.

What a Saudi-Israeli Deal Could Mean for the Palestinians

Biden must push Netanyahu to forgo annexation of the West Bank.

www.foreignaffairs.com

That article by far gave me the clearest understanding about this conflict. As someone who doesn't have any background on the history it makes my head hurt to try and absorb the information but thank you for the link.

 

[Cindy Claveau]

 

[Pancake]

Oh thank god y’all are still here and sane.

The last couple days of my usual internet haunts have been dismaying.

I really missed and needed Innula Zenovka take on things and of course Cindy Claveau was in my thoughts too for major global news events. Glad to see you here!

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

Meanwhile in NYC...

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

There were several pro Hamas rallies in the US, also in Florida. Ron DeSantis clearly despises them all equally.

Ron DeSantis: Pro-Hamas rallies ‘abhorrent’ - JNS.org

“Hamas is a terrorist group that is dedicated to the destruction of Israel and commits atrocities to further that end,” stated the Florida governor and presidential candidate.

www.jns.org

Hamas are going to execute hostages, in case palestines get killed through Israeli air strikes. There are American citizens in this unfortunate group, so this puts Biden on the table even more so.

 

[Pancake]

I suspect many that are missing are unfortunately already dead.