Generational perspective without Trump

[Cindy Claveau]

Reading this article about Chappell Roan, and how comments he's made are being discussed. What he said, though, isn't what got my attention (opinions are like buttholes, ya know). No, it was this quote by the author Ryan Reichard:

Because of her neutral stance, many people on social media claimed that Roan was a Donald Trump supporter.

"Chappell Roan by playing the ruinously ignorant 'both sides' card effectively endorsed Trump. She could have endorsed someone or just continued not making any statements, but to play that card is an insult to her LGBTQIA+ fans, in my opinion," read one comment.

"Chappell Roan's third time voting in a presidential election and it's all been in the Trump era. Younger generations don't see him as an existential threat because he's always been part of politics in their adult life," added another.

I bolded the part that got my attention. Whenever I've thought about the American voter, I haven't considered the various age strata very much. When I hear how many people plan to vote for Trump, I scratch my head and wonder what they're thinking. This article and this quote offer one possible explanation for why younger people may not understand the existential threat posed by Trump's autocratic tendencies.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

Seems a bit simpler than that

‘No, I’m not voting for Trump and yes, I will always question those in power,” Chappell Roan said in a recent TikTok video clarifying why she is not stumping for Kamala Harris in the forthcoming US presidential election. As she had explained to the Guardian last week, she doesn’t “feel pressured to endorse anyone” – having previously denounced the Biden-Harris administration’s failure to robustly defend queer rights against hundreds of anti-LGBTQ+ bills tabled by Republicans, and their ongoing support for Israel during the assault on Gaza that has killed more than 40,000 Palestinians.

She followed up with another video on Wednesday: “Obviously fuck the policies of the right,” she said, while also castigating what she called “some of the left’s completely transphobic and completely genocidal views”. She said she was voting for Harris, “but I’m not settling for what has been offered … this is not me playing both sides. This is me questioning both sides.”

 

[Free]

My only problem with Chappell is her publicist.

Roan told Rolling Stone that she had initially considered accepting the invitation and using the appearance as an opportunity to protest the U.S. government’s support for Israel’s war in Gaza. “I had picked out some poems from Palestinian women,” she told the magazine. “I was trying to do it as tastefully as I could because all I wanted to do was yell. I had to find something that’s tasteful and to the point and meaningful, and not make it about me and how I feel.”

However, the singer said that her publicist convinced her it wasn’t a good idea, telling her, “You f**k with the president and the government, your security is not the same, and neither is your family’s.”

 

[Noodles]

I bolded the part that got my attention. Whenever I've thought about the American voter, I haven't considered the various age strata very much. When I hear how many people plan to vote for Trump, I scratch my head and wonder what they're thinking. This article and this quote offer one possible explanation for why younger people may not understand the existential threat posed by Trump's autocratic tendencies.

Not that Trump is any better, but another thing to consider, especially in the eyes of the younger generations, The Democrats kind of really are just as shitty as the Republicans.

To some extent, the older generation of Progressives have had some time to accept and realize that broad change is just, not going to ever instantly occur.

But for the younger folks, they see the wishy washy do nothing aspects of the Democratic party as being as bad as the shit on everything of the Republican Party.

 

[Cindy Claveau]

Not that Trump is any better, but another thing to consider, especially in the eyes of the younger generations, The Democrats kind of really are just as shitty as the Republicans.

To some extent, the older generation of Progressives have had some time to accept and realize that broad change is just, not going to ever instantly occur.

But for the younger folks, they see the wishy washy do nothing aspects of the Democratic party as being as bad as the shit on everything of the Republican Party.

I don't agree with this at all. The only "shitty" thing I've seen the Dems do was when they bum-rushed Biden out of office (which has turned out great - Joe didn't HAVE to cooperate and willingly step aside). I'm being hyperbolic, of course, but every major party has infighting. The GOP is even worse - to the point that the Dems can publicly claim "we're not like those other guys".

I'm always ready to change my mind. I just don't see the Democrat party being anywhere near the same level of stupid ass that we've seen from the GOP.

 

[Noodles]

I don't agree with this at all. The only "shitty" thing I've seen the Dems do was when they bum-rushed Biden out of office (which has turned out great - Joe didn't HAVE to cooperate and willingly step aside). I'm being hyperbolic, of course, but every major party has infighting. The GOP is even worse - to the point that the Dems can publicly claim "we're not like those other guys".

I'm always ready to change my mind. I just don't see the Democrat party being anywhere near the same level of stupid ass that we've seen from the GOP.

They (especially Harris) aren't really pushing any sort of universal healthcare program.

The handling of the current Israel/Palestine conflict leaves a lot to be desired.

It's not clear that they have any real plans or goals with the increasingly severe wealth inequality problem.

They are not more aggressively pushing for lower tier offices where Right Wing Extremists are increasingly taking a foothold.

They are not being nearly aggressive enoigh at pointing out the actual lies and problems of the GOP (though this is starting to get a tiny bit better).

I am sure there are other issues that it feels like they sort of pay lip service to but when it comes down to the times they actually have the power to fix things, they just dick around about it until there is no longer a majority then throw up their hands in a "what can we do, the Republicans are stopping us" fashion.

They are not nearly as bad as the Republicans, but they seem to be mostly happy to push along with the overall status quo of things rather than actually push progressive meaningful change.

Kind of like, look where we got with Roe. It was "just fine" as a court ruling instead of pushing it as an actual law and protection. And now it's fucked.

 

[Cindy Claveau]

They (especially Harris) aren't really pushing any sort of universal healthcare program.

We must watch different news

The handling of the current Israel/Palestine conflict leaves a lot to be desired.

Like every other Administration for the last 76 years?

It's not clear that they have any real plans or goals with the increasingly severe wealth inequality problem.

Please watch a few of Kamala's speeches. That is one of many major pieces of her program.

They are not more aggressively pushing for lower tier offices where Right Wing Extremists are increasingly taking a foothold.

Again: we must be watching different news. The Harris campaign has scheduled rallies specifically to help the down-ballot races. They're giving hundreds of thousands of dollars to lower ballot candidates.

They are not being nearly aggressive enoigh at pointing out the actual lies and problems of the GOP (though this is starting to get a tiny bit better).

How much more do you want? Kamala has fiercely and directly taken on the GOP's lies. So has Tim and most of the other Dem candidates I've heard.

They are not nearly as bad as the Republicans, but they seem to be mostly happy to push along with the overall status quo of things rather than actually push progressive meaningful change.

Kamal's only been a candidate since what? June? The Harris campaign is good, but they're certainly not perfect.

 

[Free]

Kamal's only been a candidate since what? June? The Harris campaign is good, but they're certainly not perfect.

End of July. I know, a lot has happened in a short time.

 

[Jopsy Pendragon]

It's politics. Every 'fix' comes with a cost. A cost that breaks something else, or agrees to leave it broken, so that it can be exploited by those whose influence is needed to make changes.

We'll never fix the Middle East. Period. We only continue to try because it panders to some and profits others, and there's benefits to keeping them happy.

We'll never fix climate change, because there's too much wealth tied up in -not- fixing it, and that wealth has been actively working to burn our political process to the ground for years, rather than put up with being told to change.

Healthcare is a swamp of grifters running a scam, and they don't even offer fake snake oil, they offer to pay for fake snake oil and then refuse too. If anything should be socialized and regulated, it's healthcare insurance because running it for profit is fucking evil. But again, there's too much wealth and influence behind it to make it change.

Politics has always been about the illusion of serving the masses while protecting the wealthy from them. Sometimes they manage to squeak a positive change in for everyone, just to keep the illusion going... but it's the only thing standing between us and a feudal despotic oligarchy.

rawr, blather, froth, rawr... pardon my cynical ranting. Haven't had my morning coffee yet.

 

[Noodles]

I mean, I want to be wrong here, and don't get me wrong, I will vote for the Dem ticket all the way, but I feel like 2028 will roll around and not much will have changed and it will be Vance/Greene pushing the same crap as Trump is now.

I just want actual noticable and good changes to maybe wake the Idiot Cult up to the fact that their world sucks because of their support of Regresionist asshole grifters in the GOP.

 

[Cindy Claveau]

I mean, I want to be wrong here, and don't get me wrong, I will vote for the Dem ticket all the way, but I feel like 2028 will roll around and not much will have changed and it will be Vance/Greene pushing the same crap as Trump is now.

I just want actual noticable and good changes to maybe wake the Idiot Cult up to the fact that their world sucks because of their support of Regresionist asshole grifters in the GOP.

I'm less worried about Trump '28 than '24. He may be in prison or dead by '28, but if we - the entire nation - sends a clear signal by an overwhelming electoral margin, it's going to wound the GOP greatly. They're already struggling with internal divisions, stupidity and lunacy. Now they're also faced with a mutiny in their own ranks.

It may not be overwhelming. The media is really loud about how close the race is, but I frankly don't trust their metrics. I'm still getting over Hillary, who they said was over a 90% certainty to win. The mature, intelligent among us voters don't need predictions. We vote like our lives depend on it.

But no matter the outcome, human life will not end (hopefully). The GOP will be about a million times more ignorant and ineffective than the Dems, which will save us all.

I worry a lot less since I've recognized that I have absolutely no influence on any outcome beyond my vote. The GOP will continue to screw up, their candidates will lose more often than not as long as Donnie's calling the shots.

 

[Jopsy Pendragon]

I worry a lot less since I've recognized that I have absolutely no influence on any outcome beyond my vote. The GOP will continue to screw up, their candidates will lose more often than not as long as Donnie's calling the shots.

They picked him because no matter what shots he calls, nothing happens. No wall got built, his tarrifs backfired, his covid plan was to ignore it until it went away, his attempt to end Obamacare suffocated, his crusade for deregulation fizzled as bridges collapsed, plants exploded, power grids failed.

The power brokers on the right back him because he's -all-talk-. No facts, no follow-through. Leaving them free to do their dirtywork behind the scenes while he takes credit for whatever fiction he's spewing day to day.

Only a few decades ago, the right wing were the one's trying to bring about an American World Order. Neocons who wanted to leverage our powerful military to -take- what we wanted, until that idea got reality checked hard with the whole Iraq/Afganistan mess.

It seems like that whole movement got the Kristi Noam gravel pit treatment. Their primary objective now seems to push for more unsustainable economic growth, worsen labor conditions, subsidize and give tax breaks to the rich, and to pillage, loot and plunder as much as they can while they fortify their enclaves preparing for the impending climate change/over-population societal collapse they're working so hard to bring about.

 

[Soen Eber]

I think one thing the Democrats have dropped the ball on, is making the people who keep saying "The Democrats are doing nothing" understand the role the right has had in blocking their efforts. Why do you think the Republicans had so many votes to undo the Affordable Care Act? To hammer that into certain cranial apertures of their core demographic group.

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

I'm less worried about Trump '28 than '24. He may be in prison or dead by '28, but if we - the entire nation - sends a clear signal by an overwhelming electoral margin, it's going to wound the GOP greatly. They're already struggling with internal divisions, stupidity and lunacy. Now they're also faced with a mutiny in their own ranks.

If Trump won't make it in 2024, then he will for sure not be allowed to enter the ballots in 2028, because why would the GOP allow a 2 time looser to loose a 3rd attempt?

 

[Veritable Quandry]

If Trump won't make it in 2024, then he will for sure not be allowed to enter the ballots in 2028, because why would the GOP allow a 2 time looser to loose a 3rd attempt?

Because American political parties have no central decision making process, which Trump has take advantage of. At this point enough precinct level officers support him that the rules will be tilted in his favor if he decides to run in 28.

 

[Cindy Claveau]

If Trump won't make it in 2024, then he will for sure not be allowed to enter the ballots in 2028, because why would the GOP allow a 2 time looser to loose a 3rd attempt?

They've backed an obvious loser for 8 years and haven't become self-aware yet.

But yes, that's a fair point if we're talking about a rational, logical political party. I'm reluctant to label the GOP that way.

 

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

Yup the GOP might not be rational but still intelligent enough to understand you if someone failed 2 times for sure he will fail a 3rd time. Plus I am counting on the greed of the GOP to stay in power. Betting on a dead horse will not grant you that.

So even if intelligence goes out of the window the greed for power might still work in our favor then.

 

[Cindy Claveau]

So even if intelligence goes out of the window the greed for power might still work in our favor then.

I think the real irony is that this is the same greed for power that has led them to normalize and enable the worst President in history.