Dems Need To Learn From the UK Election to UNITE under one message: GET HIM OUT!

[Kaimi Kyomoon]

I'm with you Dakota, in fact at this point I'm planning to vote for every Democrat I can to the bottom of the ballot. In the past here in CA we could vote for primary candidates of every party. But something has changed and we have to be registered Democrat to vote in their primary. And it's already too late to change affiliation. Supposedly we can take our mail-in ballets to our polling place on election day and trade them for Dem's ones. Maybe we could take them to the registrar of voters office and change them in advance. I'd hate for all my agonizing over who I want to vote for to be for nothing.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

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[Kara Spengler]

Biden always seems like a boxer who retired too late. It's uncomfortable to watch. He'd make Trump seem like an intellectual giant in a debate.

Yeah, the dnc and corps like him because he is a centrist. Meanwhile he is too far to the right for most of the party.

 

[Kara Spengler]

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That is an understatement. It is more like your enemy has shot you 100 times so you get up and turn your back on them for the 101st time trusting they will do something different this time even as they are saying that is not the case.

 

[danielravennest]

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Is it too early to call him a cheese-eating surrender monkey?

 

[Cristalle]

I think Clinton claimed that one candidate, Tusli Gabbard, (so not several) was the favourite candidate of the Russians, who she said were supporting Gabbard with bots and websites, which may or may not be true, but isn't the same as calling her "a Russian asset" (on my reading of Ciinton's remarks, she called Jill Stein, not Tusli Gabbard "a Russian asset")

Clinton suggests Gabbard is ‘favorite’ candidate of Russians

Hillary Clinton appeared to suggest that Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-Hawaii) is the “favorite of the Russians” to win the 2020 presidential election.Clinton also said “they” are grooming Gabbard to …

thehill.com

It must make sense to you why someone should encourage a crowd at a rally intended to support Bernie Sanders to attack Hillary Clinton for attacking one of Sanders' rivals, but it doesn't really make sense to me -- what's that got to do with the proposition that Bernie Sanders is a better choice than any of the other candidates in 2020 rather than 2016?

Clinton called Jill Stein a "Russian asset," but she used the word ALSO in that quote, indicating that she did indeed mean to infer that Gabbard is a Russian asset. They only walked it back to "Republican asset" post hoc because of the serious implications of calling a currently serving Army officer a traitor.

As for Tlaib, it's not just about what Hillary has done to Gabbard. It's about her continuing to spread the lies about Bernie hurting her because he had the temerity to finish the race, and didn't endorse her right away, even though he worked 4x as hard for her as she did for Obama. This coming from the woman who wouldn't bow out against Obama in case he was murdered like RFK.

 

[Cristalle]

I'm just going to say that it is fucking hilarious when people who denounce both Hillary Clinton and Elizabeth Warren for pointing out the very real misogyny present in our electorate (and system for that matter) declarinbg them to be "playing a card", yet those same people decry the upset with Rashid Tlaib as "sexist and racist".

Hypocritical, AGAIN. But then, that is what I expect of certain Bernie supporters, just as I expect the same behavior of Trump supporters. Two sides of the same coin, in some instances. I guess some people just want a "daddy" figure. Mommy is too mean, I guess. Daddy promises ponies, mommy makes you eat your vegetables.

There is a difference between "pointing out misogyny" and shivving your "friend" to illustrate the point. She has never stated exactly what he said for us to judge, nor given room for the possibility for misinterpretation. Because it's extremely unlikely that the man that has been for women's rights for 40 years would say that she couldn't win, and I'll take his record for truthfulness over hers for a number of very public reasons.

 

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

 

[Anya Ristow]

1. The Intercept is reporting that the failed app was paid for by the Iowa and Nevada Democratic parties, so we can look forward to its use in Nevada, too...and also by Pete Buttigieg's campaign. LOL. I'm going to be more charitable than some and say that the intent was for Mayor Pete to be able to quickly announce a good result...and I hear he did do well.

2. MSM broadcast networks are apparently already spinning this as reason we should doubt the results. Which means they know Bernie won.

3. Nina Turner has said that if we do get results tonight, Bernie will come back out and say something. That was a while ago, though.

ETA 4. Pete's speech has been characterized as a victory speech, but I haven't heard it.

 

[Cristalle]

1. The Intercept is reporting that the failed app was paid for by the Iowa and Nevada Democratic parties, so we can look forward to its use in Nevada, too...and also by Pete Buttigieg's campaign. LOL. I'm going to be more charitable than some and say that the intent was for Mayor Pete to be able to quickly announce a good result...and I hear he did do well.

2. MSM broadcast networks are apparently already spinning this as reason we should doubt the results. Which means they know Bernie won.

3. Nina Turner has said that if we do get results tonight, Bernie will come back out and say something. That was a while ago, though.

ETA 4. Pete's speech has been characterized as a victory speech, but I haven't heard it.

Last posted numbers before NYT took them down was Bernie, Elizabeth, Pete.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

Clinton called Jill Stein a "Russian asset," but she used the word ALSO in that quote, indicating that she did indeed mean to infer that Gabbard is a Russian asset.

Where does she use the word "also"? According to the article from The Hill I linked to, Clinton

said Republicans were also ready to encourage a third-party candidate, saying they already have their “eye on somebody who’s currently in the Democratic primary and are grooming her to be the third-party candidate,” in an apparent reference to Gabbard.

“She’s the favorite of the Russians. They have a bunch of sites and bots and other ways of supporting her, so far,” Clinton told David Plouffe, the podcast’s host and the campaign manager for former President Obama’s 2008 campaign.

“And that’s assuming Jill Stein will give it up, which she might not because she’s also a Russian asset,” Clinton added, referring to the 2016 Green Party presidential candidate.

Clinton suggests Gabbard is ‘favorite’ candidate of Russians

Hillary Clinton appeared to suggest that Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-Hawaii) is the “favorite of the Russians” to win the 2020 presidential election.Clinton also said “they” are grooming Gabbard to …

thehill.com

I take "Russian asset" there to refer to Jill Stein, who Clinton says is not only the third-party candidate but also a Russian asset.

I can see how it can be read it as referring to Gabbard, but to me, at least, it reads much more naturally if you assume that "she" doesn't change referents mid sentence, over a few words -- "She [Jill Stein] might not because she [Stein] is also a Russian asset."

If Clinton had said "She's a Russian asset too" then I agree it would be be different, though still ambiguous, but "She [Stein] might not because she [Gabbard] is also a Russian asset" seems to me a forced reading -- what's the "also" doing there, if the second "she" is Gabbard and not Stein?

 

[Cristalle]

Where does she use the word "also"? According to the article from The Hill I linked to, Clinton

Clinton suggests Gabbard is ‘favorite’ candidate of Russians

Hillary Clinton appeared to suggest that Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-Hawaii) is the “favorite of the Russians” to win the 2020 presidential election.Clinton also said “they” are grooming Gabbard to …

thehill.com

I take "Russian asset" there to refer to Jill Stein, who Clinton says is not only the third-party candidate but also a Russian asset.

I can see how it can be read it as referring to Gabbard, but to me, at least, it reads much more naturally if you assume that "she" doesn't change referents mid sentence, over a few words -- "She [Jill Stein] might not because she [Stein] is also a Russian asset."

If Clinton had said "She's a Russian asset too" then I agree it would be be different, though still ambiguous, but "She [Stein] might not because she [Gabbard] is also a Russian asset" seems to me a forced reading -- what's the "also" doing there, if the second "she" is Gabbard and not Stein?

The implication is that third-party candidates having the temerity to participate in our democracy are Russian plants.

So when speaking about Stein, Clinton is saying that Stein was a Russian plant because she dared challenge Clinton for the presidency. But with Tulsi now being the Russian plant, that can only happen if Jill Stein gives it up. That's the way I read it.

 

[Anya Ristow]

Just saw TYT's clips from Pete's speech. "We don't know all the results...By all indications, we are going on to New Hampshire victorious!"

Cenk says that AP is reporting that Pete declared victory.

 

[Anya Ristow]

I can see how it can be read it as referring to Gabbard, but...

Hillary Clinton suggests Republicans are grooming Tulsi Gabbard for third-party run

Asked if the former secretary of state was referring to Gabbard, Clinton spokesman Nick Merrill said, "If the nesting doll fits..." He later tweeted that Clinton was referring to the GOP grooming Gabbard, not Russians.

Note that he didn't say, "she wasn't talking about Tulsi."

 

[Innula Zenovka]

The implication is that third-party candidates having the temerity to participate in our democracy are Russian plants.

So when speaking about Stein, Clinton is saying that Stein was a Russian plant because she dared challenge Clinton for the presidency. But with Tulsi now being the Russian plant, that can only happen if Jill Stein gives it up. That's the way I read it.

How do you turn “And that’s assuming Jill Stein will give it up, which she might not because she’s also a Russian asset,” into "“And that’s assuming Jill Stein will give it up, which she might not because Tulsi Goddard is also a Russian asset"? "Also a Russian asset" in addition to being what?

And, even you do, it would seem to mean Goddard's being a Russian asset will make Stein less likely, not more, to give up her positions third party candidate -- that is, exactly the opposite of what you say it does.

If they're both Russian assets ("she's a Russian asset, too", as you seemed to think she said) then wouldn't that make Stein more likely to cooperate with her Russian handlers, not less, if they asked her to withdraw in order to give Goddard a clear run?

 

[Cristalle]

How do you turn “And that’s assuming Jill Stein will give it up, which she might not because she’s also a Russian asset,” into "“And that’s assuming Jill Stein will give it up, which she might not because Tulsi Goddard is also a Russian asset"? "Also a Russian asset" in addition to being what?

And, even you do, it would seem to mean Goddard's being a Russian asset will make Stein less likely, not more, to give up her positions third party candidate -- that is, exactly the opposite of what you say it does.

If they're both Russian assets ("she's a Russian asset, too", as you seemed to think she said) then wouldn't that make Stein more likely to cooperate with her Russian handlers, not less, if they asked her to withdraw in order to give Goddard a clear run?

It's assuming a run with the Green Party, of which Stein was the candidate last time. (She is not running this time, so Clinton's ignorant smear about her is just doubly stupid.)

It sounds to me and most people as if Clinton is positing that Stein as the Green candidate last time is unwilling to give up her aspirations to the office (even though it's already public knowledge that she's not running). But with Tulsi supposedly now being favored by the Russians, that would be a conflict.

As for it making sense... no, none of it makes sense. But the point of these harangues is not to make sense but to get the media talking about it for days, to plant seeds in people's minds and believe it, to the point that some people do stuff like this:

Tulsi Gabbard campaign signs vandalized with Soviet communist symbol in New Hampshire

 

[Innula Zenovka]

Hillary Clinton suggests Republicans are grooming Tulsi Gabbard for third-party run



Note that he didn't say, "she wasn't talking about Tulsi."

Yes, but whe

Hillary Clinton suggests Republicans are grooming Tulsi Gabbard for third-party run



Note that he didn't say, "she wasn't talking about Tulsi."

What it says is

In a recent interview, Clinton didn't mention Democratic presidential candidate Rep. Tulsi Gabbard of Hawaii by name, but said she believes one candidate is "the favorite of the Russians." Asked if the former secretary of state was referring to Gabbard, Clinton spokesman Nick Merrill said, "If the nesting doll fits..." He later tweeted that Clinton was referring to the GOP grooming Gabbard, not Russians.

If I say that that Clinton was the favourite of the British government" in the 2016 election (which she was), do you take that as meaning that's because she was an asset of MI6?

 

[Anya Ristow]

According to Bernie's people (Jeff Weaver, I believe), based on 40% of precincts in all four districts, the first count was 28% Bernie, 20% Pete, 19% Elizabeth, 13% Joe, 11% Amy. Final count 29% Bernie, 24% Pete, 21% Elizabeth, 12% Joe, 11% Amy.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

It sounds to me and most people as if Clinton is positing that Stein as the Green candidate last time is unwilling to give up her aspirations to the office (even though it's already public knowledge that she's not running). But with Tulsi supposedly now being favored by the Russians, that would be a conflict.

but you said in your previous post

So when speaking about Stein, Clinton is saying that Stein was a Russian plant because she dared challenge Clinton for the presidency. But with Tulsi now being the Russian plant, that can only happen if Jill Stein gives it up. That's the way I read it.

If they're both Russian assets (not plants) then doesn't Russia get to decide which of its assets runs?

 

[Cristalle]

but you said in your previous post

If they're both Russian assets (not plants) then doesn't Russia get to decide which of its assets runs?

If this was designed to make sense, yes! She didn't even say that. Clinton's smear is just a bunch of nonsense from a number of angles.