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Clara D.

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I just don't wanna replace a bag of shit with another bag of shit.
My fear about Bloomberg: he's another Trump, but not stupid.

Sinister, plotting evil is more insidious than flailing around and foaming at the mouth evil.
 

Innula Zenovka

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It would be quite something if the US presidential elections turned into a contest between two elderly white billionaires (or one billionaire and someone who claims to be one), both of whom seem to have entered national politics as a retirement hobby, trading insults on Twitter.

Makes sense, in a way, I guess -- there must be plenty of billionaires in the US thinking, "Sounds like fun. If an idiot like Trump can do it, then I'm sure I can."

Those of us who are familiar with the clashes between Pompey and Caesar, and their supporters Milo and Clodius, during the last days of the Roman Republic may notice uncomfortable parallels.
 

Beebo Brink

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It would be quite something if the US presidential elections turned into a contest between two elderly white billionaires (or one billionaire and someone who claims to be one), both of whom seem to have entered national politics as a retirement hobby, trading insults on Twitter.
This juxtaposition can -- if we're brutally honest with ourselves -- provide some insights into why some perfectly intelligent people voted for Trump.

Have we become just as blindly "anti-Trump" as some people were "anti-Hillary"? Do we think that literally anyone would be better than Trump, and that "the office will change the man" if someone truly dodgy like Bloomberg is the candidate? Will we let the prospect of party control muffle the voice of concern about Bloomberg's character and record? The GOP thought that Trump would help them more than hurt them, and that the "grownups" around Trump would manage him to limit the damage. How well did that work out for them and for the country? It's the height of hubris to vote in someone subpar for self-interested reasons and then just hope for the best in hobbling your choice.

For me, the parallels between the GOP holding its nose and supporting Trump and the Dems holding their nose and supporting Bloomberg are growing more stark. Fingers crossed that he's just a blip, the flavor-of-the-day for our yapping media heads. But no one took Trump seriously either at the start of the primary campaigns.

Yes, it is possible to vote for someone worse than Hillary Clinton. And yes, it is possible to vote for someone worse than Trump.
 

Eunoli

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Have we become just as blindly "anti-Trump" as some people were "anti-Hillary"? Do we think that literally anyone would be better than Trump, and that "the office will change the man" if someone truly dodgy like Bloomberg is the candidate? Will we let the prospect of party control muffle the voice of concern about Bloomberg's character and record? The GOP thought that Trump would help them more than hurt them, and that the "grownups" around Trump would manage him to limit the damage. How well did that work out for them and for the country? It's the height of hubris to vote in someone subpar for self-interested reasons and then just hope for the best in hobbling your choice.
For me, yes. Even if he's awful in a lot of other ways - if he's the candidate, I'm all in. He won't sell the country to Russia. My biggest issue right now is saving Democracy.

Mind you, I still think that even if he wins, Trump isn't going to just leave. We're in for a super big crisis.
 

Clara D.

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This juxtaposition can -- if we're brutally honest with ourselves -- provide some insights into why some perfectly intelligent people voted for Trump.

Have we become just as blindly "anti-Trump" as some people were "anti-Hillary"? Do we think that literally anyone would be better than Trump, and that "the office will change the man" if someone truly dodgy like Bloomberg is the candidate? Will we let the prospect of party control muffle the voice of concern about Bloomberg's character and record? The GOP thought that Trump would help them more than hurt them, and that the "grownups" around Trump would manage him to limit the damage. How well did that work out for them and for the country? It's the height of hubris to vote in someone subpar for self-interested reasons and then just hope for the best in hobbling your choice.

For me, the parallels between the GOP holding its nose and supporting Trump and the Dems holding their nose and supporting Bloomberg are growing more stark. Fingers crossed that he's just a blip, the flavor-of-the-day for our yapping media heads. But no one took Trump seriously either at the start of the primary campaigns.

Yes, it is possible to vote for someone worse than Hillary Clinton. And yes, it is possible to vote for someone worse than Trump.
If it comes down to Bloomberg vs Trump I don't know what I'll do. Unfortunately, I'm not in any position to bail to Canada >_<
 

Eunoli

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Putin is not the only threat to democracy. "Saving" it is a multi-front battle, and if you think Bloomberg is an improvement (which is possible), I still wouldn't drop your guard.
First step is get Trump out. Second step is bring back norms. I personally don't think Bloomberg is going to get the nomination and I think its not a bad thing that his cash will then be on the dem's side.
 

Fionalein

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The comments pretty much mirror my thinking: it’s not about policies, it’s about stopping Trump and Trumpism.
Pretty much true, cleaning up the swamp will occupy much of whoever replaces him, policy changes can wait another 4 years, there are more urgent matters now.
 
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Clara D.

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People voted for Trump to drain the swamp.
And got a rabid raccoon instead \o/

And now we're discussing whether a gator would be preferable.

Because, hey, at least it doesn't have rabies?
 
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Innula Zenovka

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There's a bit of Crassus in Bloomberg too.
I agree, but I think there's a lot of Crassus in Trump, too -- I can really see him getting a kick out of turning up a house fires with his retenue of fire-fighting slaves and literally offering the house owner a fire-sale price, and as for having all the captured slaves crucified up and down the Appian Way after Spartacus' revolt... Trump would really love to do that (so long as he had been able to stay in the background during the actual battles, and wear a smart uniform), and he'd have got a triumphal procession out of it, too.
 
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Innula Zenovka

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This juxtaposition can -- if we're brutally honest with ourselves -- provide some insights into why some perfectly intelligent people voted for Trump.

Have we become just as blindly "anti-Trump" as some people were "anti-Hillary"? Do we think that literally anyone would be better than Trump, and that "the office will change the man" if someone truly dodgy like Bloomberg is the candidate? Will we let the prospect of party control muffle the voice of concern about Bloomberg's character and record? The GOP thought that Trump would help them more than hurt them, and that the "grownups" around Trump would manage him to limit the damage. How well did that work out for them and for the country? It's the height of hubris to vote in someone subpar for self-interested reasons and then just hope for the best in hobbling your choice.

For me, the parallels between the GOP holding its nose and supporting Trump and the Dems holding their nose and supporting Bloomberg are growing more stark. Fingers crossed that he's just a blip, the flavor-of-the-day for our yapping media heads. But no one took Trump seriously either at the start of the primary campaigns.

Yes, it is possible to vote for someone worse than Hillary Clinton. And yes, it is possible to vote for someone worse than Trump.
Even if Bloomberg isn't able to buy the nomination -- for that's what it would be -- then I think the Democrats, at least, are going to have to give serious consideration to how they choose their candidates in future.

That's going to be interesting, since it might be a challenge to come up with rules that would have disqualified Bloomberg yet allowed Sanders to participate.
 
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Eunoli

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There are some very serious and compelling reasons to vote for Bloomberg over Trump if he is nominated:

1) The Dems as a party are not going to support him if he breaks the law. Impeachment would be removal.
2) He's not going to put babies in cages. His own party wouldn't stand for it even if he was that evil.
3) He's not going to bow down before dictators. He's not reliant on them for money like Trump is.
4) He's not going to turn the presidency into a cash cow. He doesn't need it.
5) He believes in science.
6) He believes in climate change.
7) His 'base' isn't going to be a rabid bunch of white supremacists (even if he has done some smary things in the past)

I'm not saying that I hope he's the nominee. I don't. I'm just saying that if he is, there's a ton of reasons to vote for him over Trump.