Bernie Has A Mean Followers Problem

Katheryne Helendale

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I'm seriously torn on not bothering to vote in our primary at all, because early voting starts this week and well, Covid-19 worries and all, or going and voting either for Warren because she is still on the ballot for Florida. I get Our Revolution emails still, and I'll say while I don't have a problem with Bernie himself, you are judged by who you associate with, and too many of the people he has surrounding him, are in the same basic class as Ted Cruz - wouldn't even buy a used car from them.

*I wouldn't buy a used or even new car, since I don't know how to drive, but if I did....
I voted for Warren last Tuesday. I knew she didn't have a good chance by that time, but I voted for her anyway because it just felt right to me. You should go vote, especially if your state or district has down-ticket nominees, such as for US Representative or Senate, or even state assembly or senate spots. As for the president spot, just vote for who you feel is right. Even though she's no longer running, continued votes for her sends a message that she should seriously consider running again in 2024.
 

Salome

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As I recall you saying on more than one occasion, "nobody is owed our vote.".
Hypocrites gonna hypocrite.

I think it would be a mistake for Aribeth in that she might later regret not having made her voice heard, but your hypocrisy couldn't go unchecked.
Aribeth’s choices are her own, naturally, but I hope everyone remembers that the top of the ticket is usually the least important part of any ballot. Down-ballot measures and local races will affect most of us much more meaningfully and are worth casting a ballot for.
 

Dakota Tebaldi

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I realize that's an image, so here's the actual tweet:


Go ahead and look. The replies are absolutely filled with legions of Sanders supporters that are piling on Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez as a "fake socialist" for thinking Warren's SNL bit was funny, because of their burning-passion hatred of Warren.

Read that ridiculous BS, and tell me that these people aren't real and it's all being made up by "the establishment". Look at those people and what they do and say, that they then mock other people for complaining about.

Those people are freaking lunatics. They are Sanders cultists, not supporters. And for all their protestations about having the moral high ground and being the only ones who "legitimately" care about the poor and disadvantaged, you know every single one of these pricks is white-privileged as hell.
 

Jolene Benoir

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Hypocrites gonna hypocrite.


Aribeth’s choices are her own, naturally, but I hope everyone remembers that the top of the ticket is usually the least important part of any ballot. Down-ballot measures and local races will affect most of us much more meaningfully and are worth casting a ballot for.
Agreed. I think Aribeth just meant the primary, but yes for sure down-ballot measures and races are more important than ever, as well. My state didn't have anything but the nominees for president, but others might? I just meant that down the road she may wish that she had made her voice heard. Of course, up to her completely.
 
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Brenda Archer

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I'm seriously torn on not bothering to vote in our primary at all, because early voting starts this week and well, Covid-19 worries and all, or going and voting either for Warren because she is still on the ballot for Florida. I get Our Revolution emails still, and I'll say while I don't have a problem with Bernie himself, you are judged by who you associate with, and too many of the people he has surrounding him, are in the same basic class as Ted Cruz - wouldn't even buy a used car from them.

*I wouldn't buy a used or even new car, since I don't know how to drive, but if I did....
If you mean his official campaign and other real-life people, I can see that. Those are people he chose, or can publicly contradict.

But if you mean the anonymous online mob, all he can do is denounce them. We often don’t even know who they are.

It’s really on the platforms to close down these accounts, and I’m not sure they have the will. Democrats infighting is good for Trump.
 

Brenda Archer

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I realize that's an image, so here's the actual tweet:


Go ahead and look. The replies are absolutely filled with legions of Sanders supporters that are piling on Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez as a "fake socialist" for thinking Warren's SNL bit was funny, because of their burning-passion hatred of Warren.

Read that ridiculous BS, and tell me that these people aren't real and it's all being made up by "the establishment". Look at those people and what they do and say, that they then mock other people for complaining about.

Those people are freaking lunatics. They are Sanders cultists, not supporters. And for all their protestations about having the moral high ground and being the only ones who "legitimately" care about the poor and disadvantaged, you know every single one of these pricks is white-privileged as hell.
The real ones are.

My time on Twitter has convinced me that a significant percentage of posters on all sides of all issues are not who they claim to be. They are easily exposed if you waste time arguing with them, and they eventually all sound the same.

Except for the blue checkmark people, there is no authentication on Twitter.
 
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Cristalle

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That is rich when you make excuses for the people who voted Stein, Bernie or abstained in 2016.

As I recall you saying on more than one occasion, "nobody is owed our vote.".

I think it would be a mistake for Aribeth in that she might later regret not having made her voice heard, but your hypocrisy couldn't go unchecked.
Two things can be true at one time. She has the right to do what she wants to do, and I'm not disputing her right to do that. But since this is a discussion board, I get to question her reasoning. as I've said multiple times, I wasn't Bernie or bust. And the data showed that most people weren't.
 
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Aribeth Zelin

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Whatever you do, please show up for the general. America's allies really would like to have our friend back. :flower:
Even when i didn't vote in primaries [there is a reason I finally registered as a dem - closed primaries suck], I have always voted in general elections.
I voted for Warren last Tuesday. I knew she didn't have a good chance by that time, but I voted for her anyway because it just felt right to me. You should go vote, especially if your state or district has down-ticket nominees, such as for US Representative or Senate, or even state assembly or senate spots. As for the president spot, just vote for who you feel is right. Even though she's no longer running, continued votes for her sends a message that she should seriously consider running again in 2024.
We have a second primary for all the other races, president is all by itself - no clue why, but Florida.
Agreed. I think Aribeth just meant the primary, but yes for sure down-ballot measures and races are more important than ever, as well. My state didn't have anything but the nominees for president, but others might? I just meant that down the road she may wish that she had made her voice heard. Of course, up to her completely.
I did. And around here, we're just blue-tinged enough to usually have someone running against our idiot of a congress critter, but its not usually a close race [except '18 - our county at least seemed to want to get rid of the idiot].
If you mean his official campaign and other real-life people, I can see that. Those are people he chose, or can publicly contradict.

But if you mean the anonymous online mob, all he can do is denounce them. We often don’t even know who they are.

It’s really on the platforms to close down these accounts, and I’m not sure they have the will. Democrats infighting is good for Trump.
I did mean his official campaign team - I get you can't control your supporters, but dear gods, he's a mess of those too.
 

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Those people are freaking lunatics. They are Sanders cultists, not supporters. And for all their protestations about having the moral high ground and being the only ones who "legitimately" care about the poor and disadvantaged, you know every single one of these pricks is white-privileged as hell.
I was trying to explain the existence of this Warren-hatred to a co-worker last week. He was completely mystified by it and couldn't really wrap his head around why Sanders supporters would react that way.
 

Brenda Archer

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I was trying to explain the existence of this Warren-hatred to a co-worker last week. He was completely mystified by it and couldn't really wrap his head around why Sanders supporters would react that way.
We also saw a lot of sexist hatred for Clinton. I distinctly remember people telling me I was wrong to prefer Clinton because she was “establishment” and conspiracy theory BS.

It’s my belief, which I can’t prove, that the anonymous online mob strongly overlaps with incels, Gamergaters and other forms of typical online trouble.

The Sanders supporters who look like RL people, and the ones I follow, don’t look this way. They are diverse by race and gender and tend to be under 50 (but not all).

I judge the anonymous ones by how they sound, if they sound like incels, bots and whatnot, that’s probably (but not provably) what they are.

Meanwhile real life people are being asked to rein in an anonymous online mob. Other than making abuse reports to a Twitter that’s now partly Republican owned, what can they do? All prominent women on Twitter get the most vile harassment from this mob, including AOC and Ilhan. It’s not right to say Left wing women and POC support it.
 
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Anya Ristow

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About 20 years ago I had a hobby website that received the slashdot treatment. They prided themselves in being able to take down websites with their traffic, and the thread on my website was pretty abusive with predictable comments about "too much time on her hands", and worse. Some of it much worse. That was just a fucking hobby website. I had a barter arrangement for its hosting, and after the slashdot treatment I had to find a new host.
 

Brenda Archer

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About 20 years ago I had a hobby website that received the slashdot treatment. They prided themselves in being able to take down websites with their traffic, and the thread on my website was pretty abusive with predictable comments about "too much time on her hands", and worse. Some of it much worse. That was just a fucking hobby website. I had a barter arrangement for its hosting, and after the slashdot treatment I had to find a new host.
Sorry this happened. It’s been going on for so long. I hope you’re safe now.
 

Salome

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I was trying to explain the existence of this Warren-hatred to a co-worker last week. He was completely mystified by it and couldn't really wrap his head around why Sanders supporters would react that way.
One of the really frustrating things for me right now is that because the media likes Warren they are suddenly discovering all these things as if they’re new. Warren couldn’t get traction, so maybe sexism exits. Hey, Bernie’s vile and toxic followers might a problem now that they’ve turned on Warren. Women Dems have been complaining about the Chapo Bros for years, but many in Bernie’s campaign still interacted with and promoted them, but they went after Warren so now maybe they’re a problem...

I don’t mean you, obviously, but for years this has been blown off by both the official campaign and the media so it’s not only festered and gotten worse but it’s been validated to a certain extent by all the “oh, it’s the same on all sides” and “so what if someone was mean to you on the Internet” lack of clear rebuke. Every so often Bernie mumbles something about “if people are doing X, we don’t want them“ and then his official campaign people go right back to promoting and interacting with toxic people.

That dude above who broke federal law last night by abusing the Biden app for his dementia “prank”? He was going to be officially hired by the campaign to make videos because he’s oh-so-edgy. His hire was announced. Then some reporters did five minutes of preliminary vetting and found the vile, sexist, and racist ”joke” videos he’d made that were still up (Including a parody of the MLK “I have a dream” speech titled “I have a wet dream...”). Even though his campaign position was revoked, many official Bernie campaign staff and surrogates expressed annoyance at “SJWs not being able to take a joke” and continued to promote him. Jane Sanders was still promoting him as “important” as recently as January. But they’re still trying to pretend like this is just an anonymous online mob issue.
 

Anya Ristow

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I would not be so sure. Bernie had a 15-point lead over Biden in Texas in surveys before Super Tuesday. Really anything can happen.
There's also last year's precedence. Hillary was killin' it in the polls over Michigan last year, and Bernie won it.

Also, the Dem primaries aren't winner takes all, so a loss in a state isn't the end of the world, as long as the loser takes some delegates. Michigan is important because it's a swing state, but it's not the end of the line for the loser.

Then there's the March 15 "debate". It'll be the first one where Biden has half the time. We'll see how that goes. (being CNN I expect the questioners to be plants, as in the past, tossing softballs, but he still has to answer coherently).

Then there's coronavirus. The more it enters the public awareness, the more people wish the people around them all had access to healthcare. Expect Sanders to make that a talking point on the 15th, no matter what hostile questions the plants fire at him.
 

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Will universal healthcare be the takeaway from the coronavirus outbreak? I suspect a fair amount of the swing towards Biden is that he may be an old-school politician, but he has been part of a successful and stable administration. People don't want to make radical changes in the middle of a crisis: they want someone who can be professional and get shit done. Middle of the road competence has a reassuring quality to it.