2020 Democratic Primary

Salome

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Beebo Brink

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Sanders also paid a price for his reluctance to speak publicly about his role in the civil rights movement, some allies felt, despite having an impressive story to tell about impassioned activism that included an arrest at a 1963 protest.
His reluctance does him credit. This is not impressive anymore. This happened 57 years ago. If anything, this is EMBARRASSING to even bring up because it shows how little Sanders has done recently.
 

Fionalein

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His reluctance does him credit. This is not impressive anymore. This happened 57 years ago. If anything, this is EMBARRASSING to even bring up because it shows how little Sanders has done recently.
To be fair the US made us believe that was a problem of the past, just like we Germans did with Antisemitism - until recently there was no need to do something becsaue everyone was clapping their shoulders and telling the fable of how much better our nations were today compared to the past ...

Taking actions needs spotting a problem in the first place.
 
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Beebo Brink

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To be fair the US made us believe that was a problem of the past....
Honestly, I can't tell what point you're trying to make. Some White Americans try to pretend that the fight for civil rights is settled, but you have to be a right-wing Republican to get away with that belief. Sanders, on the other hand, is supposed to be pitching his ideas to the Democratic party members who know good and well that black Americans are still getting a raw deal. And it's his unwillingness or inability to recognize race as a factor is exactly why he's lost so much ground (and frankly deserves to). Racism is a known problem, not a hidden one.
 

Fionalein

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Just because everyone should see the problem does not mean they actually do. The way you try to raise awareness to it has a good chance to actually harm your cause. I can imagine quite a bunch of folks might actually have gone and voted for the orange one because of the constant accusations of being closet racists.
 
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Salome

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Just because everyone should see the problem does not mean they actually do. The way you try to raise awareness to it has a good chance to actually harm your cause. I can imagine quite a bunch of folks might actually have gone and voted for the orange one because of the constant accusations of being closet racists.
Wow. So the people who have been tirelessly struggling for racial equality are to blame for the shift toward white nationalism, but it’s understandable that Sanders has been virulently anti-immigrant and racially clueless because he blamelessly fell for the fable that racism is all in the past?
 

Aribeth Zelin

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I think we're having a language issue here.

Thing is, Sanders is supposed to be progressive, and is Jewish - he should know better [just like Ben Carson should]. Its not like the last 50 years have been all roses and champagne.
 

Salome

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I think we're having a language issue here.

Thing is, Sanders is supposed to be progressive, and is Jewish - he should know better [just like Ben Carson should]. Its not like the last 50 years have been all roses and champagne.
Yes, but it’s not just that he should know better, it’s that he’s got very problematic history and has never worked with activists and civil rights leaders to undo the damage. Instead he holds court with academics who already like him and give him a pass and that just doesn’t work with the electorate.

But “people voted for Trump because they’re tired of having racism pointed out to them” is a really, really dodgy claim regardless..
 

Ranma Tardis

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I will vote blue but refuse to support a National committee that refuses to support our Oklahoma candidates.
 

Lady Darnk Juniorette

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Salome

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Salome

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That wasn’t a shot at you. It’s just that while I found her initial claim of sexual harassment credible when she came out with the other women, she was the one with the most dodgy history. Now she‘s suddenly escalating the story to assault it makes the whole thing a total clusterfuck. As with Broaderrick, the change in claim and timing looks opportunistic and rather than be able to have an examination of the complexities we’re going to get the usual circus.

Which is, of course one of the reasons why many of us wanted a fucking woman on the ticket in the first place.we started out with four strong possibilities but they were ignored or labeled a cop, a bitch, a snake, etc., because two old white dudes couldn’t fuck off.
 

NyteWytch

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Unfortunately, Biden is a believable perpetrator. I'd hate to see people just slam and drag her like they do many other women accusers. Her story deserves to be heard just like accusers of trump and kavanaugh. Unfortunately, magats dont really care if anyone is guilty otherwise they wouldn't be ok with a pussy grabbing braggart in the white house.
 

Salome

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Unfortunately, Biden is a believable perpetrator. I'd hate to see people just slam and drag her like they do many other women accusers. Her story deserves to be heard just like accusers of trump and kavanaugh. Unfortunately, magats dont really care if anyone is guilty otherwise they wouldn't be ok with a pussy grabbing braggart in the white house.
The thing is that her story was heard the first time and unquestioningly accepted because it fit with (1) Biden’s observed behavior, and (2) the consistent stories told by more credible women. This new version changes things significantly. And while it’s going to be heard (or else it wouldn’t be in the news), it’s messy. What that means is that as far as her being slammed, that’s now, unfortunately, inevitable. Changing her story so soon after first coming forward is a problem. A few of her previous statements and writing demonstrates a susceptibility to propaganda and that’s another problem. The fact that this escalated version of her story is coming out at a politically convenient time that just happens to coincide with her current politics when her preferred candidate just happens to need a miracle to justify staying in the primary is a third problem. Any responsible journalist would need to thread that needle very carefully and do some digging. But in our current state of affairs that’s a pipe dream. Our clickbait-driven media landscape is not nuanced enough to navigate problematic self-identifying victims with responsibility or thoughtfulness in general, and, of course, since this broke in the Intercept sphere, no one’s even going to try.

As far as Biden is concerned, I don’t really care. How this plays out for him is going to hinge on whether or not more women come forward with these kinds of new allegations. But the general electorate has already shown they don’t consider harassment or “non-violent” assault to be disqualifying. It was the integrity of Dem leaders, not public sentiment that forced Franken to step down and that not only took eight women on both sides of the aisle but has been an unfair albatross around Gillibrand’s neck since.

My concern is for abuse survivors who are going to go through another exhaustingly brutal round where it’s made clear our country only cares about victims when the narrative around them provides grist for blood and circuses.That open wound is why many of us wanted ANY of the qualified women in the primary to be the top of the ticket.

I hate this fucking timeline.
 
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Which is, of course one of the reasons why many of us wanted a fucking woman on the ticket in the first place.
What's interesting is, you can say this and almost no one will disagree with the point. Fucking. Sad.

(And yes, it's one of my reasons for focusing on women candidates these days.)